Well, it's round number three with the stealer and the warranty / tsb rotor work.

For the third time they had to correct the severe shaking when I apply the brakes. Warped rotors again was the cause noted on the work-order. They now said they used the new machine which turns the rotors on the vehicle to true them up to the hub assembly. And they just sanded the pads and re-used them stating they were just fine and had plenty of material left on them. I am not buying it. No mention of the heat damage to the rotor the pads that would probably cause repeat incident #4 shortly down the road. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I have told the stealer each time that I want them to check the LSPV in the rear when they check the rear brakes as no matter how hard or soft I brake I can feel the vehicle nosing down when I stop. They told me on the previous trip that it was my rear drums causing the vibration, but yet I can go down the road, pull up the parking brake and it is smooth with no shuddering at all. Kinda blew that theory out of the water for them.

In any case, I am looking to do what Gadget did and just buy a new set of factory rotors and use the performance friction pads. Plus since the stealer seems to not follow directions well, I am going to take a look at the LSPV adjustment myself. Problem is I need to find where I can get the guage that is required to make the proper pressure adjustment to it and I am not sure where to start to find one.

I hope Gadget will chip in if he is still using the factory rotors with the Performance Friction pads and if so how are they working out. And if anyone else has some good suggestions I would sure appreciate hearing them.

Shuddering brakes rates tops on my list of irritating events while driving and I am just gonna have to fix it myself. Again, Gadget's rule #1 DEFINTELY applies here. Don't let the stealer touch your vehicle. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Thanks in advance ...

Ricochet

i am the opposite. get a set of brembo crss drilled brake rotors and then a set of factory pads.

havent had any problems in 3-4 years...

Ricochet, I do not belive our trucks have a LSPV. I know that in the factory service manuals its in their but its not on my truck and I highly doubt you have one either. I belive its called a load sensing proportioning valve its job is to sense where the axel is in relation to the vehicle. All tacomas have em and my little sister land cruiser also, they all have a bar or some sort of connection to the rear axel. The only things connected to our rear axels are the brake line, ebrake line, and 5 links(a four link system with a pan hard).

Anyhow about the front rotors warping. Its my experience that the wheels on our trucks need to be progressivly torqued down in a cross pattern. Without doing this proper torquing of the wheel lug nuts my rotors warped(rather fast)...its would come on very slightly and get worse and worse. Now since I began religiously torquing my wheels every time I take one off I have not had any problems with rotors warping. Also my dad had the same problem with his tacoma and he got our local stealer to replace the rotors...as soon as he got home I retightend the wheels with a quality torque wrench and now many thousand miles later I have yet to hear anything about the brake vibes. So what ya think? Chad

Leo, I have thought about a set of slotted-rotors but I am still debating about cost. As Gadget had pointed out in previous posts, the factory rotors will cost less and since I already have the Performance Friction pads (part# 4364) I just need to make a decision on how well the factory rotors will hold up. Hopefully in quick fashion before the problem creeps back again as I am sure it will.

Notrub, I agree about the wheel lugs needing to be properly torqued, but one would guess being aluminum wheels that the stealer would have enough sense (I know, it's a stretch) to do it right. I will check mine tomorrow and see what kind of torque setting was used on my lugs when they worked on it yesterday. As for the LSP& BV (I looked it up in the shop manual), I thought I saw it on my Runner up on the frame (passenger side). When I talked with the stealer service mgr he indicated the valve could be out of adjustment but not likely. But I still asked them to check it but they did not.

I'm gonna give it a few days and see what happens and in the mean time check the torque settings on my wheel lugs. What concerns me is that while on my way home tonight driving in normal traffic, I detected just a slight hint of shudder from the front again while braking in stop and go traffic, and it's only been 1 day since the work was done. I just feel it is comng back if I don't do something soon about it.

Thanks guys for the input.

Ricochet

If your truck has ABS it does not have the normal LSPV for the rear brakes. The brake byass adjustment is built into the modulator pump depending on the ABS system. That is one I have not tinckered with.

If you do not have ABS there will be a LSPV mounted on the frame over the rear axle.

Make sure your rear brakes are properly adjusted. That one thing make all the difference. Also, adjust them every oil change and you should see a dramatic improvement in your braking performance and rotor life.

Gadget

It's not clear to me how the LSPV is related to your truck's tendency to nose-down during braking. The LSPV will adjust front-rear bias, i.e. which end locks up first, but you're still always going to get some nose dive when braking. It's simple weight transfer. Drive really fast in reverse and hit the brakes, the nose will lift up. LSPV adjustment isn't going to affect that.

don't cross drilled rotors get mud and pepples stuck in the holes? it seems good ol' brembo slots are the way to go because the stockers are not that great unless you drive pretty soft (who does that?) while under warranty though you would think there would be at least one competent person at a dealership to check out your ride after returning several times. wtf?

Ricochet,
Earlier this year I had a brake vibration problem and let it go for months then read Gadget's site about just changing out to new rotors instead of having them turned. Instead of ordering rotors on-line I went to AutoZone for mine. Changed them out myself. It's been 4 or 5 months and stopping is as smooth as butter. $54.00 each.

AutoZone has rotors made by Aimco. Aimco is a subsidiary of Dana Corporation (DCN on the New York Stock Exchange for anybody interested). It's a major car parts manufacturer. I considered Brembos but now I think I made a wiser choice by buying Aimcos. I saved money, didn't have to wait for mail order deliveries, and stops like new. BUT, if you still get a nose dive something might need to be adjustd before your problem is solved.

Just my recommendation.

BTW, find another (and good) place to have your brakes adjusted. After I put my little 1.5" lift on the stealer screwed up the alignment twice before I took my 4Runner to an independent who did a perfect job.

Rob

"Accuturn" is what turning the rotors while on the car/ truck is called.

I had mine done that way also. Mine have gone quite a while without going back to the vibrating PIA's that they were.

I still think it's related to the back brakes. Not them vibrating, but the fact that the backs come out of adjustment cause the fronts to work more; thus heating up.

Mine felt like it was coming back the other day but have not felt it since. I also do the ol' parking brake deal where I work the parking brake up and down about 20 times. Someone told me this adjusts the back brakes and since I have not had the problem in quite a while, I am thinking this works.

Looks funny from the outside though! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Mike

Gadget, you are absolutely correct. Since I kept hearing about the ABS being different I took a peak under the vehicle and no LSPV. I guess I am flashing back to my 98 Taco 4X4. Strange though that the stealer did not mention a single word about it not having the LSPV. In any case I did have them turned on the vehicle, and I am going to re-check the rear adjusters this weekend. Apparently with the rears coming out of adjustment so easy, the fronts are indeed taking the brunt of the braking and heating up the rotors causing my nose dive as mhawker noted. What a PITA this brake thing is becoming!!

I have also noticed that my parking brake takes a couple extra clicks before it holds the vehicle.

Rob, thanks for the info on the Aimco rotors. I will check into them to see what they look like and how they compare with the factory rotors.

I am still concerned that the problem is going to come back, because I understood that once the rotor is warped due to over-heating that the rotor will never stay true even after being re-surfaced because the metal develops hot-spots that machining will not fix. Maybe I am mistaken. If anyone has better info on that aspect please pass it on here.

Kyoso23, as far as dealer competance, I am not sure even the service mgr has much at this point. It's a shame too because thier job is to know the Toyota vehicle and help to make things right on it, but apparently that is not the case.

Thanks to everyone elses input as well. Of all the Toyota's I have owned my 4Runner has been the only one with an aggrevating brake problem. But I am not giving up and will work through it until I have a handle on it.

Ricochet

<small>[ December 21, 2002, 02:04 AM: Message edited by: Ricochet ]</small>