My friend has a 89 Trooper that he bought with a dead transmission. He replaced the tranny with that of his wrecked 88 Trooper and put a new clutch in as well. The problem though is the starter. The original starter in the new 89 trooper was turning over incredibly sluggishly and then finally starting up after a few seconds. He thought it was a bad started so he replaced it with the one from the wrecked 88 and it was having the same problem. He also replaced the battery and that didn't help at all.

Lately it's gotten so bad that he has to push start it just to get the thing going and it's proven to be a big problem. Now also he's been experiencing a whooshing sound near the peak of the compression stroke that's concerning, but it wasn't apparent until lately. And on the compression stroke sometimes the Tach surges almost up to 2000rpm and it still fails to start.

Now he has gotten it to start up sporaticly, but still he needs to get this solved as soon as possible. What could it possibly be? My best guess is that the new battery he got is crap and doesn't have enough cold cranking amps to turn the engine quick enough.

p.s. I'm writing this post as a sort of bet with my friend because he refuses to believe that I can figure this out in 5 minutes on a car forum. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> So please help me, I got quite a bit riding on this.

Thanks guys!

Sluggish, huh? These starters generally either do or don't... moving slow isn't likely the starter. Most surely not since you swapped a known-good starter in place with the suspect one and got the same result.

I'd check the starter cable -- sometimes they can corrode internally and look just fine externally. Check its resistance. I'm presumin that in replacing the battery and starter, you wire-brushed the cable ends and contacts to keep 'em clean?

Dunno about the "whoosh."

Randii

Yeah, that's something I forgot to add. The battery terminal clamps were cleaned (I think actually replaced) and there is no corrosion. The battery cables look fine though although we didn't really inspect them in depth.

Thanks for the suggestion. We'll check the starter cable tomorrow to see what's up.

I've noted that the switch on the clutch that's supposed to prevent you from cranking the engine with the clutch engaged doesn't alway require that the clutch be completely disengaged, so it will crank a bit slower. It's possible that there's air in the hydraulic clutch so that even when you do push the clutch pedal to the floor it's not fully disengaging. That's pretty likely if you had any leakage while replacing the clutch.

It's also possible that the new clutch is binding on the splined shaft of the transmission instead of sliding on it. It doesn't take much of a kink or burr on the shaft to hang up the friction plate. Hopefully a dab of grease went on the shaft before assembly. And of course it's possible the friction plate went on backwards. A lot of the aftermarket stuff isn't marked and the extra length on the neck of the splined insert (that's supposed to face the transmission) in the clutch plate might contact the end of the crankshaft and keep the friction plate in contact with the pressure plate. I say might 'cause I've never actually done it, but there must be a reason there's a inner and outer side.

I'd go with my first guess. There's air in the hydro side of the clutch so it's not fully disengaging. It would only be really noticible in first and reverse or starting. The rest of the gears the syncro rings would accomodate.

Ok, update... I'm going to keep this simple because I just spent about 10 minutes writing this up and my friends crappy network connection decided to dump it.


- Took new battery to Advance and it turns out it was bad, got a new battery

- Bled clutch line and replaced fluid, the old fluid was the blackest, nastiest fluid I've ever seen come out of an engine

- Checked starter cable and it appears to be pretty new looking, did not check connections though so that's something we're going to do today

- When the clutch was installed he had help from our mechanic friend that has done MANY clutch installations before, we're absolutely certain it was installed correctly.

- Just went up to Advance auto and tested the new NEW battery and alternator and they are in good working order...


When he got the replacement battery it seemed to be doing a bit better. The starter is still incredibly slow compared to my 88 Trooper, but it would catch and start the truck. Now it's doing the exact same thing again. It's just cranking so slow that the engine isn't starting. When its cranking all the accessory pullys move fine so it is def trying to start, it's just the starter is going so freakin slow that it's not enough to turn the engine over...


Any more suggestions guys? We need to get this fixed soon as my friend has gone long enough without reliable transportation, which means that i'm tired of giving him rides to work.

Something's not making sense here. If it's not the starter (you replaced it) and it's not the battery (you replaced it) and it's not the clutch (you replaced it) then something's not doing what you think it's doing.
Did you adjust the free pedal play to accomodate the new clutch? There's not much difference in distance between a clutch that's engaged vs. one that's released. If you look at the action of the slave piston pushing the throw out bearing arm it's only about a half inch of movement. Anything less than that and it's not going to disengage the clutch fully. If the fluid was black that's a good sign the seals are worn. Look for signs of leaking at the dust boot of the master cylinder where it comes through the fire wall and at the slave. It doesn't take a lot of air or much of a leak to stop the hydraulic action. If some one in the cab pushes down the clutch to the floor and you can push the throw out bearing arm back you've got a seal leak and your clutch is not disengaging. A bad cable would probably sizzle rather than slow the start. The problem sounds mechanical.

Sounds like you have a bad ground. Are all your frame to engine grounds good? You replaced any/all grounding straps when you swapped the tranny?

Use some jumper cables but use one side, connect one end to a good bare metal part of the engine then the other side to a bare spot on the frame and see if that gives your starter more power.

I've recently discovered the value of doing voltage drop tests to diagnose starter problems, but its difficult to explain and you need a good multi-meter.