I know it's a 3.0. I was stating a comparison. I always just start at the crank pulley and install it ccw, using a wrench on the cam pulley to noodge it into sync and then tension it slightly, just hanging the back edge of the belt, waiting to sock it all the way home until the belt is started all the way around, then tapping it into full engagement. The dside pulley is stable at the timing mark, while the pside cam pulley is poised on the point of the cam lobes, metastable at best. It will tend to pop off the mark. I like to keep it more stable with a box end wrench while getting the timing belt on right. Once installed, I hand rotate the motor two full turns back to the crank mark and check the cam sprocket timing again.

Eddie: That's exactly how I did it. I even paintmarked lines on the old timing belt before taking it off and then transcribed them onto the new timing belt (this just helps insure that one doesn't get off a tooth somewhere and have to reinstall the tensioner again, etc).

So, I got it back together and installed into the truck and it sounds like the timing is off. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but with the timing covers off (and cam marks and crank gear marks lined up), #1 is at TDC compression. In other words, with timing covers off and all marks lined up, it isn't possible to be off 180*, right? I don't see how it's possible to be off 180* at that point, because 2 revs of crank=1 rev of each cam sprocket. Plus, the valves cycle completely with one cam rev. So, unless I'm smoking crack, I think it's impossible to be 180* out AS LONG as you can see the timing marks on the cam gears.

I hadn't turned the engine at all, and when I installed the outer crank pulley, the TDC notch in the pulley was about 1/4" to the right of the TDC mark on the plastic timing cover. I know the engine was still dead on with the marks underneath, however, because I hadn't turned it at all.

So, anyway, I install and stab the distributor. I looked at the book and it had #1 on the left side of the dist cap (looking from the front), so I then installed the cap and made a mark on the dist housing to correspond to #1 position on the cap. Then, as usual, I turned the rotor to correspond to the mark I had made on the housing. Last time I checked, this was the proper way (although it's been awhile since I've done one). I should say, when I stabbed it, it seemed like the rotor was off a tooth - in other words, when I chose one tooth, the rotor was pointed slightly off my mark on the housing. When I chose the next tooth, it was slightly off the opposite side of the mark. I thought no big deal - if it doesn't start, the I will move it to the other tooth...

Tried to start, and it sounded ok when cranking, but wouldn't fire up. Moved to a tooth clockwise, and sounded worse, and had some "compression bumps" (almost to where it caused the starter to stall). So, moved it two teeth counterclockwise (a tooth further counterclockwise than my original position), and encountered the same thing. Moved it back to the original tooth and hit it with ether - it would try to run but was backfiring through the intake.

What gives? I did used the Hyundai cams and heads and injectors - the cam gears had the same number of teeth. Could the grind of the cams be so different that it would cause the timing to be way off. I think not, but I'm kind of scratching my head at this point.

I did this last night and I've been at work today, so I've been scratching my head all day about it. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

At this point, I will have to align the crank pulley and then check my rotor on the dist to see if I'm at TDC or 180* out (since I can't see the marks on the cam gears). Once I get it back aligned and at TDC, I will pull distributor and check my marks on the housing, etc again, and go from there. I have a feeling that I won't find anything different, but I will double-check. If I don't see a problem, then I'm kind of at a loss for what to do.

Incidentally, should I hear a fuel pump when I have the key in the first position? I can't remember - the truck ran a few weeks ago when I pulled it into the shop, but I guess it's possible that I blew a fuse or something. (It was late lastnight so I had to get to bed). I'm not hearing a fuel pump, but I would think it would still run on ether, but it may be a pressure issue or something. I may have had the timing dead on and am just not getting fuel, and without pressure I might get backfiring and all of that [censored]. Or, could it be the Hyundai injectors? They are a different part number...

Anyway, any suggestions would be welcome! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Oh, and any suggestions that could be made within the next two hours would be even more greatly appreciated - I will be checking it out some then...

Thanks!

Here's how I do it:

I use no marks on belt, not ness. and that just adds to the frustrations.
1st--- stick your distibutor in to make sure your on # 1 TDC and line the notch on the crank belt gear up with the mark on the oil pump. I scratched marks on the plate below the rotor before disassembly. Put your cam gear on the marks. Valves won't hit the pistons so you can turn cams around without problems , in case you have timing way off.
2nd---Very helpfull---stick a small piece of ''''''cardboard'''' between the belt and oil pump to hold the belt on the T belt crank gear. That's where it jumps off while your messing with the belt at the cam,while your not looking.
3rd- move your distib. side cam 1/2 tooth advanced of the mark. Put the belt on and wrench the gear back onto the mark.
Very important---use Black paper clip thingys to hold belt on cam gear.
Move Passenger side cam 1/2 tooth,,,again the paper clips and rock the gear back to position.
release the belt tentioner.
I ues a ratchet and crank the H.B. bolt around 2 time to be sure, with the distributor installed to make sure of 1 on TDC.
Looking at the distibutor in place, on number 1 the rotor sits at around 11:00,,,even though on the cap # 1 wire sits at about 8:00.

Do it dave's way and it will work. Look closely at the underside of the dizzy cap. The external wire locations DO NOT match the interior locations, so the wires can exit on the correct side of the motor. The internal firing order is 123456. I can't remember what the external one is, but it's DIFFERENT.

I set the crank and cams to the marks. THe dside cam will be stable on the mark, with the cam not on the peak of any cam lobe, and both valves for number 1 will be closed. The pside cam will be poised on the peak of a cam lobe, and want to jump off if disturbed in any direction. If the above all holds, the engine is mechanically in time on tdc 1. Now install the dizzy.

Install the dizzy this way. Look at the dizzy drive gear and the lower dizzy shaft housing. There is a drilled mark and a cast line. Turn the shaft to align these and hold it there. Stab the dizzy with the retaining stud centered in the adjustment slot or aligned with any cast mark, letting the shaft start to rotate as the helical gears engage. Gear engagment should be pretty smooth and in line, with only minor hunting for the slot in. I test and fine set the timing with a light. If you are 180 out, you won't see the timing notch.

If the timing marks on the timing cover don't line up. I think you have the belt off a notch. Yes, you have to take off the a/c and ps pump and that monster bracket and all that crap again.

Make sure the install of the plug wires is correct. All decent dizzy caps will have the cylinder #'s cast in.

OK, got it running. Yeah, I had the belt on right, and I knew that, but the dist was giving me some problems. I must have inadvertently jumped two teeth or something when I was stabbing the thing Sun night. That, or there was some hiccup with something else and it just didn't want to hit off. The reason I say that is because I think it started on one of the three teeth that I originally tried. (I'm not sure exactly because I didn't zero the crank in last night after starting it - so I don't know exactly where the rotor was - I will check that either this evening or maybe not until the weekend)

I have a high idle so I'll put the light on it and see exactly where it's at. I'm not sure where the timing is supposed to be for the 1990 Hyundai Sonata, but I will try to find it online. If I get is set correctly and still have high idle, I'll go from there (incidentally, even though the old motor was coughing pretty bad and leaking all over, it had high idle also - I suspected that since it was running a little rough, someone had turned the dist a little to compensate and keep it idling, etc). Anyway, we'll see.

If anyone knows the timing for the Hyundai, please chime in. Or, a hypothetical for high idle if indeed it still occurs after timing is set correctly. (I've got the throttle stop backed off and I'm aware of the solenoid).

Thanks! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />

on cams: Chrysler, Mitsu "low compression engines" and Hyundai Sonata on AllDataPro and Chiltons Bibles:
valve opens BTDC 19o
valve closes ATDC 59o
overlap 39o
duration 258o

According to what Dave said earlier (above), the cam grinds are the same. So, tomorrow evening I will try the timing specified on the underside of the hood (assuming it's still there) for the Mitsu.

I will do a write-up of the project soon, but actually it was fairly straightforward. Basically, I stripped everything off both engines and swapped to the Hyundai. The Hyundai essentially ended up being a "long block" - as in the only things that weren't disassembled and swapped were the block and the heads and internals. Everything else was swapped. I'll elaborate in more detail later...

Incidentally, since I'm being lazy, can someone tell me the ideal timing settings for the Mitsu? That's just in case the decal isn't under the hood or is unreadable...

Thanks in advance, and thanks guys for the advice that was prompt and professional. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />

5* BTDC with the timing plug grounded.

Thanks Hazy Daze for the timing info. I was told on another forum 3-7*, so you're dead-on.

OK, dumb question - does my truck have the ignition wire that needs to be grounded? My book implies that it does (along with Hazy), but it also shows it up by the washer pump and says "on Montero". On mine, there is no plug there at all, except for a plug that goes to the brake master cylinder. So, if I have one, where is it? There are two plugs on the harness, down by the coil/ignition module that aren't being used, but they are a single spade each, compared to a bigger plug that the book shows on the firewall.

Any info would be great.

Put the timing light on it and got it close, but without grounding a wire (assuming I need to), it was probably a waste of time.

Thanks guys for the wisdom - I don't normally work on these things (I'm a diesel guy), so it's great to get quick and accurate advice.

They move those plugs around on different models , but I think the plug looks the same.
Same kinda plug as in the O2 wiring harness. It has a snapon piece/cap that looks like 2 wires should be comming out. Take the cap off and there is only one prong.
I bet it's along the firewall, probaby where the main harness comes thru the firewall.
I'll check Thurs. at the library alldatapro program if nobody else helps you first to find it.