Well, like herpes, here I am back again.

With the generous help of Hazy's loaner parts I've tested every component of the ignition system that has been discussed.

Ignition coil, Ignition Control Module (Transistor), ECU, Fuses, Control and Fuel Relay, plugs, wires...all test good.

The ONLY thing I am not 100% certain about are the sensors in the distributor. Via the test linked to above, I confirmed that the sensor was getting power and a good ground.

Here is the text from Steps 12 and 13:
[color:"blue"]"TEST 12: Crank Sensor Signal Circuit

As mentioned earlier... the Crankshaft Position Sensor, on your 3.0L V6 Mitsubishi (or Dodge) vehicle, is two sensors in one. One part produces a Crank Sensor Signal and the other a Cam Sensor Signal.

This test step will verify that the Crank Sensor part is producing a good Signal that the PCM can use to start Ignition Spark and Fuel Injection.

IMPORTANT: If your vehicle starts and runs, then this confirms that the Crank Sensor is working and you do not need to test it, therefore, proceed with this test only if you have gotten a No Spark Result from all of the Spark Plug Wires (TEST 1) and no Spark from the Ignition Coil tower (TEST 4).

With key in the OFF position.
Disconnect the Ignition CoilÆs electrical connector. This is IMPORTANT... do not proceed with this test without disconnecting this connector.
Connect the BLACK wire of LED to the wire identified with the number 3 in the photo.
Connect the RED wire of the LED to the BATTERY (+) POSITIVE terminal.
Have your assistant crank the engine as you observe the LED Light.
The LED Light should flash on and off the whole time that the engine is cranking.

CASE 1: If the LED Light flashed on and off the whole time the engine was cranking, then the Crank Sensor part of the Crank/Cam Sensor Assembly is creating and sending its signal. The next test is to test the Cam Sensor part of the Crank Sensor, go to TEST 13.

CASE 2: If the LED Light DID NOT flash on and off the whole time the engine was cranking, then the Crankshaft Position Sensor is BAD and is the cause of the NO SPARK and CRANKS but DOES NOT START Condition. Replace the Crankshaft Position Sensor in the Distributor.

TEST 13: Cam Sensor Signal Circuit

Testing the presence of the Camshaft Position Signal is also done using an LED light and follows the same test steps you performed in TEST 12:

With key in the OFF position.
Connect the BLACK wire of LED to the wire identified with the number 4 in the photo.
Connect the RED wire of the LED to the BATTERY (+) POSITIVE terminal.
The LED may come on and stay on.
When all the connections are secure and all is ready... have your helper crank the engine.
The LED Light should flash on and off the whole time that your helper is cranking the engine.

CASE 1: If the LED Light flashed on and off the whole time the engine was cranking, then the Camshaft Sensor part of the Crank/Cam Sensor Assembly is creating and sending its signal. The cause of your No Start Condition does not lie in the Ignition System.

CASE 2: If the LED Light DID NOT flash on and off the whole time the engine was cranking, then the Camshaft Position Sensor is BAD and is the cause of the NO SPARK and CRANKS but DOES NOT START Condition. Replace the Crankshaft Position Sensor in the Distributor.[/color] "

I did not have luck with steps 12 and 13. Both gave a solid LED illumination. However, I'm not so sure that I did these 2 correctly. 2 Reasons: 1) In a previous step I did successfully confirm and witness flashing on/off signal from the Distributor sensor to the Ignition Control Module (ICM) (observed at the ICM connector). 2) If you follow the instructions in Steps 12 and 13, how can you possibly see signal coming from the Distributor if the connector is removed? Should I be splicing into the wire in order to keep the connector installed?


Another thought...I hear fuel gurgling around in the top of the engine. Is it possible that because of all the unsuccessful cranking I have a permanently flooded engine? Bad fuel from sitting so long? But would bad fuel cause no-spark? Wouldn't think so.

I have a spare known good dizzy, but I'm terrified to pull the old one and mess up the ignition timing. Is it easier than I'm imagining?

<img src="/forums/images/graemlins/zombie.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/zombie.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/zombie.gif" alt="" />

Swapping the dizzy is easy.

Rotate the engine so that the tdc mark on the crank pulley is pointed at the tdc mark on the timing cover. To be sure you on tdc for #1 cylinder, remove the #1 spark plug and feel for increasing pressure as you approach tdc with the crank pulley. Mark the location of the dizzy bolt on the slot in the dizzy body. Remove the dizzy cap and confirm that the dizzy is pointed at #1 on the inside of the cap. BEWARE! Note that the studs inside the cap may not go straight up to the plug wire connector on the cap. Trace the bump from the stud to the plug wire connector. If all is good, mark on the dizzy body where the rotor is pointing, remove the dizzy hold down bolt and slowly pull the dizzy upward, noting that the rotor will rotate as the dizzy body moves upward. When it stops rotating, mark that position too on the dizzy body (do not use a pencil for these marks - pencil lead is a conductor...). Now stab the new dizzy in place, aligning the rotor with the second mark you made above. WHen socked all the way in, the rotor should point at the first mark. If not, pull it and try again until the rotor aligns right. Replace the cap, align the new dizzy to match the marks on the old one at the hold down bolt (this step gets the timing close enough to crank), and try to start the motor again, testing for spark at a plug or the coil wire.

Thanks Fasteddy. I might try that tonight, if the kids cooperate...

Heard back from the diagnostics webpage administrator. He said that Steps 12 and 13 need to be done with the connector in place. If nothing else, I'll try that again tonight.

Thanks!

Ray

I retested with the connector attached and got what I think is a good result..maybe.

The Crank test yielded a perfect blinking light from the LED.

The Cam Sensor test yielded a blinking light, but it was faster and irregular. At first I thought this was the culprit, but now I think it may be that the LED can't keep up with the high frequency signal. Anyone concur? Or should I go on with dizzy swap?

Despite FE's excellent description of how to swap out the dizzy, I'm still hesitant. If the sensor test was definitive then I'd already be tearing into it. But having never done it I'm sure I'll find a way to screw it up. Then I'm troubleshooting 2 problems at once.

Does anyone have any input here?

Is it possible that ignition and fuel system are not the problem? What other system could I check? I'm at the end of the road here. After dizzy swap I'm out of ideas.

Hell everything is testing fine. Maybe the thing is fine. Maybe its my imagination Maybe I should stop being so picky and just push it to work and back...

I'm soooo close to putting this f*cker up for sale. So close.

Does it have any sort of alarm on it? Aftermarket or factory?

Thanks MM.

But no, it does not.

I know you said you smelled fuel in the tailpipe at some point, but have you tried giving it a shot of either and trying to start it?

No I have never tried that trick. How is it done and where do you get the ether? Sounds like fun.

Hell, at this point if u said it would help to pee on it I'd just need to know where and for how long.

What, you haven't peed on it yet? That's the problem. I thought being from Alabama you'd know that one at birth...

Trust me, follow my directions exactly, and putting the dizzy in is a piece of cake. Worst thing you can do is get it wrong, and we'll fix it if you do...

The ecu is under the glove box, under the steel cover, in answer to your other post. Have you read for codes yet? The LED will work fine for that, plugged in to the diagnostic connector.

Its also starting fluid, you can get it at any auto parts store, just remove your air filter and give it about a 3 second spray towards the engine inside your air tube, then try to start it, if it runs for a few seconds, you have a fuel issue.Good luck METALMOVER