check out mitchells manuels aswell they are pretty good man i used them on a 2.4 swap and they listed all the details well and the diagrams are easy to read. btw duffy's got his new low range box out its up in the pirate4x4 vendor section.

Haven't tried the Mitchells manuals. This may be a stupid question but where do you find those? Never used Mitchells before.

Nice!!! I haven't talked to Duffy in a few months. Looks like exactly what we were talking about back in November. Pricing is pretty reasonable, too. I need to get in touch and have him ship a NP231 23 spline unit out. If it mounts flat and the shift box doesn't stick out too far it should work fine on my new build.

Box4Rocks billet t-case doubler

Edward

I know they are not 100% the same but on my 97 the motor ec hs not a thing to do with the tranny. The Tranny ecu does hook up to the tps tho.

I'm putting a A/T PCM into a M/T ECM so I don't need to worry about actually hooking up a TCU. I just need to get the PCM functional and not trigger CEL or have any OBD checks uncompleted. Both of which will cause the vehicle to fail the emissions test.

In '97 on the A/T Sport there are only two pins that run from the ECM to the TCU. Engine->Trans Comm line and Engine Coolant Temp.

On the 2000-2004 Sport there's a bunch A/T stuff integrated into the PCM, a couple of which I know can be 'faked', but that leaves a bunch more that I'm pretty sure can't be. It appears to be even worse with the 5-speed A/T.

What the '99 looks like is still my big question. Guess I'll find out tomorrow when I start going through the manuals that showed up today.

I'm still trying to figure out how A/C Switch 2 is implemented on the '97s. It is, because when you turn on the A/C idle speed is increased, but I can't tell if that's done in the ECM or externally. I also can't tell if those two will trigger CEL if they're not connected.

Here's what i have so far ...

'99 Montero Sport A/T PCM to '97 Montero Sport Harness Pin-out


Edward

Well, the new radiator showed up and I got it installed. Sort of. After explicitly explaining what NOT to do - they did what I told them not to anyway. I swear I will NEVER, EVER deal with Griffin again. Their manufacturing quality seems to be ok, but their customer service and support sucks pond water. My fault. I read all the posts on Pirate and went with them anyway. A mistake I won't repeat. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/angry.gif" alt="" />

So, I kinda got it wedged in. The mount pins are totally screwed up. I told them to measure form the forward edge of the core to the pin center on the stock radiator. That would give them the distance to measure from the forward edge of the core on the new radiator. So, what do they do? They just centered them on the tanks. They can't follow their own instructions so I guess its unrealistic to expect that they'd follow mine. So, now I have to find someone to grind the existing pins off and TIG some new ones on. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/angry.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, I got it mounted well enough to take it out on the highway. I replaced the condenser this week, too, and between the two my heating problem seems to be under control. The stock thermostat is 203-212 and my Stock '03 3.5L Limited runs about 203-207. The temps aren't exact since the ECM/PCM doesn't output on OBD-II in 1 degree increments. The highest I saw on the highway while fighting wind on a 5% grade doing about 70 was 210. On a 7% for several miles doing 60-65 it hit 214 but within seconds of the grade starting to decrease it dropped back to 210. Temp was between 75-85. 30-40 mph driving it sits at 203-207 with one fan barely running. Other than the stupid pins, I need to readjust my fans again for the new radiator.

I did drop it into Lo for a bit to see what happened with the temps. It's obvious that the stock 3.0L ECM has WAY too much timing for the 3.5L and my 5.38 gears. In Lo (2.72) on a 6%(or so) incline doing a couple miles an hour the timing is pegged at 40. Well, I suspected the stock 3.0L ECM wouldn't work in the long run by itself with the 3.5L.

Which brings me to the '99 PCM into my '97 swap. I think I have everything I could find in all the FSMs figured out with the exception of the transmission input and output sensors.

I don't know if this will work or not, but my idea is to permanently 'lock' the TCU part of the PCM in Neutral. The problem with the input and output sensors is that there is gear ratio math going on in the PCM and if the rear calculations don't match the front sensor, you get a CEL and it puts the PCM in limp-home mode. Based on what I've managed to find and the behavior of my '03, in Neutral the PCM doesn't use the input and output sensor data since it's not in gear and therefore won't trigger CEL.

My theory is, that in Neutral the TCU should just sit there and do nothing. The ECU should do what an ECM would do without input from a TCU - which is, just manage the engine without the transmission tweaking settings. AS LONG AS all the TCU inputs/outputs are correctly simulated.

If that works AND I can get away with a couple resistors to simulate input and output sensors I think this might work. Won't know until I get it all built and installed.

Anyway, does this sound right or did I just get ahold of some bad crack? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

I updated the link to the PDF with the table. I added rough circuit drawings and descriptions. I welcome input from anyone with more electronics knowledge than me. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'm keeping my fingers crossed but .... If it doesn't I guess a parallel MS install will be in the works here soon.

Edward

The new radiator is installed but I still have the mounting issue. Working on it. However, I fiddled with the SPAL fan controller and reset Low to 196 and Hi to 216 (according to the ECT readings in my OBD scanner). In 85-95 degree town and highway driving it floats in the mid-high 190s up to 207-210 max. It doesn't stay at 207-210 for more than 20-45 seconds unless I'm pulling a really steep grade at 65-70 MPH and only as long as its climbing - as soon as the grade starts to level it drops like a rock. I did see it hit 214 twice for just a few seconds before dropping back to 207-203. It hasn't even gotten close to turning on the second fan. So, I'm very pleased with the cooling system now - pretty much the engine is back to running exactly the same as my unmodified 2003 3.5L Limited runs. Goodness! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />

I finished the pin-out for the 1999 PCM install. I've checked all the pin-outs and notes over and over and I've been cover to cover half a dozen times on all three volumes of both the '97 and '99 Sport manuals. As much as I hate to say it, I've learned a lot about how the ECM/PCMs were programed and have a really good grasp of the wiring.

I ordered all the miscellaneous wiring and resistors last week and it's all arrived. I sent Boomslang the pin-out last Monday and they had the custom harness and extender harness to me by Friday. Four days is pretty speedy. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" /> I ordered a standard '97 ECM extender harness because I'm pretty sure I'll end up with a Megasquirt in the end. My confidence level still isn't very high that the '99 PCM swap will work in the end. I know there's stuff that Mitsu just doesn't document anywhere, so at this point I'm keeping my fingers crossed but I'm not holding my breath. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

'97 harness to '99 PCM pin-out


This is what I'm thinking for a Megasquirt. My Sports have to have barometric correction. 10,000 ft. in altitude change is way to much variation. The MS3X is required for sequential fuel injection - so that's kind of a no-brainer. It'd also be nice to plug in the Mitsu 3.5L knock sensor to the new knock board DIY just released.

MegaSquirt-III w/MS3X Expansion V3.57
MapDaddy 4 Bar MAP Sensor with Barometric Correction
MS3 Knock Module Kit
8' MegaSquirt Wiring Harness (MS1 / MS2 / MS3 Ready)
8' MegaSquirt Wiring Harness for MS3X
Weather Pack 22 position bulkhead connector kit (2)

So, a parallel install managing fuel and ignition. Maybe the IAC, although it's not necessary.

I figure, since I have the pin-outs already figured out, I'd put together a parallel MS install document. Not that there's a ton to do there if its just fuel and ignition.

I'm going to try and snap some pics of Boomslang's stuff tonight or tomorrow. But, we're off to Moab in two days so everything else is on hold until we get back late next week.

Edward

Back from Moab. Only broke the driver side frame rail behind the wheel this trip. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/angry.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Totally my fault. Forgot to get that reinforced after the PS side went. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

The radiator worked great especially after we were out in UT. With the A/C on off road in 100 degree temps everything was pretty happy. On the public roads it was a lot better, but long up hill climbs still push the temps up. Had to stop twice on Vail Pass and once on Eisenhower on the return trip to let it cool down. I guess I can tell the DSM guys that a straight across swap with the 3.0L ECM and the 3.5L engine works like they say, but ONLY if you have a knock sensor - which the Montero Sport doesn't. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, got started on the ECM/PCM swap last weekend. Commandeered one of my empty offices and set up shop. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />



The '97 ECM harness to '99 PCM adapter harness from Boomslang. They're awesome to deal with, BTW. Very nice product, too.


What I have so far. Still have to wire in the A/C and finish the A/T control relay stuff.


I'm a little more than half done. Should be able to test it this weekend on my little '97. Dropped the big one at the shop Tuesday for the frame repairs and to pull the adapter in preparation for the overdue 3-link build so I won't have that back to work with until next month.

Edward

So, after reviewing my ECM harness to PCM docs, I realized I'd forgotten a couple things and one thing didn't work the way I wanted it to. I also integrated some suggestions.

Forgot the OBD ECM and INVECS flash connectors and the transmission speed sensors. I had no protection for the PCM from the A/C and Condenser Fan relays. And, as I found out the hard way, it's not possible to normally solder leads to the dash transmission Neutral bulb.

Anyway, so now I'm waiting for some parts. Again. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Updated ECM harness to PCM wiring diagrams

I think I have the basics of a parallel MegaSquirt III MS3X installation fleshed out, too. So, for those who might care ...

http://www.4x4extremesports.com/Docs/ECM...ess_Pin-out.pdf

I guess the good thing is, if it works as I think everything does, a parallel install shouldn't be as bad as I thought. The only thing I ran into was the need for retaining a 'fake' injector in the ECM/PCM harness. The '97-05 ECM/PCM measures voltage surge on the injectors as a way to make sure they're working. If the surge isn't there, the ECM/PCM goes into limp-home mode and triggers CEL. Limited research hints that the OBD-II Montero ECM/PCMs behave the same way.

According to what I've read, the majority of the time an injector can be simulated with a big resistor. In this case, something like a 13-16 ohm, 50W monster like I'm using to simulate the automatic transmission shift solenoids. It doesn't always work. Guess I'll find out if I get that far.

I can't decide if I want to piggy back the ECT and IAT or run separate sensors for the MS so I drew both. I already have all the parts for a GM/Delphi IAT install in the intake pipe, so I'd almost certinly go that direction for the IAT. Unfortunately, I don't know of a practical place for a GM/Delphi ECT. I guess drilling and taping and existing boss in the coolant pipe isn't exactly brain surgery but the less modifications required the better in my opinion.

DIY is now selling the the new knock sensor add-on board for MegaSquirt II/III. Which is very cool, 'cause it should work with the stock Mitsubishi Gallant/Eclipse/etc. knock sensor that goes in the valley on the 3.0L and 3.5L engines.

So, do the Montero and Montero Sport 3.0L and 3.5L engines come with the threaded hole under the intake for the knock sensor from the factory even though the vehicles didn't come with knock sensors originally?

Edward

I can't say for the Montero Sport or any 3.5L, but the early Montero 3.0L SOHC engine blocks are not threaded for for the knock sensor plate (into which the knock sensor is mounted).

The block I'm using is a 10:1 C/R SOHC Diamante block that does have the holes for the sensor mounting plate, but I don't remember the year.

I'm using the OE knock sensor with a KnockSense circuit...... don't know if it works or not because I've never seen the LED light up - but my tune is conservative.

Frank

The new knock board is a LOT more sophisticated than the old knocksense setup. It'll manage two sensors independently for front/rear or left/right and there's all kinds of tweeks for the signals. So, I'm certain it'll work with the stock sensor.

That's unfortunate. I suspect that means 'the holes aren't there', then. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Not surprising 'cause that's just my luck. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Wish I'd knew more about this three months when I had both the 3.0L and 3.5L tore apart because it would have been easy to check then.

I've been looking for diagrams but haven't found any. I didn't realize there was a mount plate that bolted to the engine, and then the sensor screwed into the plate. All I've been able to find are rough schematics that basically just indicate 'this mounts in the valley under the intake'. Not real helpful. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Edward