|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: MontyMcV]
#1047159
06/07/12 07:02 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,649
Web Wheeler
|
No, balancing the motor will not take out the vibration which is inherent in an I4 motor. A boxer is two 2cyl motors combined, MMcV. I took them out of my starion motor and always regretted it. It buzzed me to death, fractured the ps pump bracket 3 times, turned the a/c bracket into about 8 pieces, turned the objects in the rear view mirror into a blur, and vibrated my big gulp out of the cup holder at least twice when empty. Keep the balance shafts and don't wind the motor to 6000 and change the belts at the required intervals.
Not responsible for advice not taken...
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: fasteddy]
#1047160
06/14/12 05:49 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 775
OP
Rock Warrior
|
Well I took mine out of the starion motor when I first built it. I dont have the vibrationn in my motor as you experienced. The only thing about the 4g64 I dont like is the rubber balance shaft belts vs the starion chain style that seems way stronger. Any way I will cross that bridge when I get there I guess. One other question I have is the pistons I am having it board out .20 and Im having a hard time finding stock .20 dish pistons. They are all flat top like what was in it stock. My compression might be around 9.2.1 or a little higher. What do you guys think? If I control my boost and Fuel/Air I should be ok.
Last edited by 87monty; 06/14/12 02:17 PM.
2003 limited 20 year anniversary 96 SR 87 Montero SWB=Turbo diesel 4BT T19 4sd with 205 transfer case
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: 87monty]
#1047161
06/14/12 12:05 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 10,238
Web Wheeler
|
You may need to use custom pistons. Wiseco is one of many suppliers. I've used Wiseco and found them very satisfactory.
If you don't want to buy custom pistons, you can use a head shim to reduce C/R. Depending on how the head shim affects valve timing, you may then need to use an adjustable cam sprocket.
You can cover up a high C/R to a limited extent with boost limitations, cam timing, ignition lead adjustment and fuel mixture, but it's your choice and gamble in the end.
I'm using head shims on my 3.0L with Diamante small chamber heads to get to 8.9:1 with no intercooler, but I've limited boost to about 6psi.
If you think you'll end up with hot cylinders, make certain you give the rings enough end gap for expansion.
Frank
'89 [color:"white"]G-Raider[color:"white"] [color:"black"]Supercharged 3.0L, MegaSquirt 2, lockup A/T, 2.5" exhaust, 172k, Cibie H4s/Oscar SCs, Hella Micro DE fogs, Cobra CB, Superwinch hubs, LSD rear/Aussie Locker front, Bilsteins, Lifeline AGM, Rust-Oleum
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: FrankR]
#1047162
06/14/12 02:25 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 775
OP
Rock Warrior
|
Thanks Frank for the info, I'm going to check the cc's on my DOHC head and see where its at. I think the one I have is at least 47cc's if a little higher even better. I was thinking aftermarket pistons but wow 500.00 is pretty steep, and would set my build back a good 6 months for sure. Stock cast .20 over are available all day long. What are stock starion are they forged? If not then I should be ok for this build. Also I found this link on balance shafts its to the point. http://www.vfaq.com/mods/balance-shafts.html
Last edited by 87monty; 06/14/12 05:26 PM.
2003 limited 20 year anniversary 96 SR 87 Montero SWB=Turbo diesel 4BT T19 4sd with 205 transfer case
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: 87monty]
#1047163
06/14/12 06:41 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,649
Web Wheeler
|
From what I've read, the cc's are the same on the sohc and dohc heads, something like 47cc's, iirc. Better check it.
Cast pistons will be fine if you don't ever detonate it. Forged are more forgiving, but not invulnerable to det.
The very efficient combustion chambers of the 4v head will handle a lot more compression than the 2v 2.6 heads. 9.2 may not be too much. The turbo Miata boys run high teens of boost on that much compression, making 250hp on stock internals out of 1800cc's without a lot of breakage. Their combustion chambers are quite similar.
Since the 2.4 dohc has a lot of squish areas, I would avoid a head shim. I've seen cases where with that kind of head, detonation increases after a head shim was used because the squish areas got too fat. Squish is an anti-detonant, because it promotes chamber turbulence when the head gets real close to the piston and the mixture gets blasted out into the open chamber. I think you will be very safe up to say, 14psi, with cast pistons and stock internals, IF you do a good job of using rich mixtures under boost and have good timing control. This means using something like a Megasquirt for spark and fuel control, NOT using a stock ecu.
Not responsible for advice not taken...
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: fasteddy]
#1047164
06/15/12 06:05 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 775
OP
Rock Warrior
|
I think your right Eddy, I have done alot of reading and found 9.5.1 or a little higher is not a problem if it's controlled like you said, I like MegaSquirt but seems you have to do alot to get what you want. So I have turned to a company called http://www.ECMTuning.com It's a stand alone system that used your eprom ECU and gives you control of all vitals for input and output such as your fuel/air ratio. Also you need to run a wideband o2 sensor so the ecu/ecm can get constant readings from the exhaust. I am simply amazed on how much these Dsm motors can put out on a stock platform with controlled boost. I have been told to go with a copper or steel head gasket because they hold up better. One other thing is im thinking of selling my 14B turbo as I have gone to the Evo8 turbo and header.
Last edited by 87monty; 06/15/12 08:21 PM.
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: 87monty]
#1047166
06/19/12 04:05 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,649
Web Wheeler
|
Not for a 16v engine - those are old 8v pistons. Check the mfr's catalog...
Not responsible for advice not taken...
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: fasteddy]
#1047167
06/19/12 05:22 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 775
OP
Rock Warrior
|
I have looked for 16V ones and no luck. (Update) I may have found some, I will keep you guys posted:)
Last edited by 87monty; 06/20/12 03:05 PM.
2003 limited 20 year anniversary 96 SR 87 Montero SWB=Turbo diesel 4BT T19 4sd with 205 transfer case
|
|
Re: 4Cyl turbo Vs V6 3.0?
[Re: 87monty]
#1047168
06/19/12 06:12 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 7,309
Trail Leader
|
I need to do my Evo's timing belts as soon as I send my students home for the summer... I too fretted over the balancer belt, but I also like how the engine works with it in there, so I bought Kevlar timing and balance belts from Gates. Might be something for you to check into too?
|
|
|
|