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Re: New Garage! #284862 06/12/03 10:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,482
azrain Offline
Emeritus Staffer and Moderator
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial, Helv, Helvetica, Sans">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial, Helv, Helvetica, Sans">Originally posted by BobG:
<strong>I'm planning getting a 12 x 24 shed to put a mill and lathe into real soon and plan to paint the slab before the shed goes up. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Tahoma, Arial, Helv, Helvetica, Sans">Make sure that slab is DEEP, I would suggest at least 12" to preclude any weird finishes on alloys when machining. The planned 2nd garage on the wife's new house (it ain't mine, I only get the garage) is 18" thick, full slab, tied seperately from the rest of the slab. Looking for the right Matsuura CNC and in it goes...

Mike

Re: New Garage! #284863 06/12/03 11:08 PM
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 9,030
randii Offline
4x4Wire.com Managing Editor Emeritus
Make sure that slab is DEEP, I would suggest at least 12" to preclude any weird finishes on alloys when machining.
Yeah, you want rigidity, and a monolithic slab is one way to get there. Get with your concrete cupplier to talk about cheaper ways -- they have some pretty high-tech concreted these days. A 6-inch slab cast with fiber across a rebar base (all on top of the appropriate gravel) may be sufficient (depends on a lot of variables, including overall dimensions) and will definitely be cheaper.

Wish I had more machine tools in my stable, but when I do, the slab awaits! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Randii


Randy Burleson
4x4Wire Managing Editor Emeritus
Mongrel Isuzu Amigo
Re: New Garage! #284864 06/13/03 06:42 PM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Sorry for jacking your thread Max. I still think you should consider the floor
paint even with welding involved. When I weld on a table, very little hits
the floor. When welding on the vehicle, you can always lay an old piece of
wall paneling down. Using a gas-ax is a whole different story. You could lay
a thin sheet of aluminum down.

Wow, I know that a good foundation is needed for the lathe and mill and was
planning on just having a 6" slab poured. Now you guys have me thinking, plus
I still need to get quotes from some concrete guys and talk about the load.
Thanks for the input, I guess I need to add more $ to my estimated costs.

Re: New Garage! #284865 06/13/03 08:12 PM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Ill toss in my 2 cents on paint and shop vac.

Paint...

I didnt paint my current garage floor, However I own a bussiness that the EPA requires floors to be sealed around one of my machines. I used a Lowes 2 part Epoxy paint to paint/seal it. This stuff is heavy duty Ive dropped 20lb 3inch pipe on it from 10ft up and it hasnt chipped yet. Stains wipe/mop right off it. I highly recomend the epoxy paint if you want to spend the money. Just make sure you really clean/prep the floor first.

Shop Vac...

Look around for a commercial hard mount vacum. Rema makes the best ones. These things can take liquids or solids with no problem, and they have 3 times the suction of portable shop vac. I plumbed mine in with 2" PVC and I use a standard Shop Vac hose/head unit I can attach it in 5 places in the shop to reach any area. With the PVC I might have put $150 into it, but thats cheap considering the price of a good shop Vac.

Stay away from peg board if possible, I have a few 2ft square sections framed for small things. But I have a wall of Slat board for my heavy stuff that I love, I picked it up from a construction recylcling place paid like 50$ for 2 4x8 sheets and lots of shelving/containers that attach to it.

Re: New Garage! #284866 06/14/03 02:50 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,482
azrain Offline
Emeritus Staffer and Moderator
Max,

Here's a link to the shelving I have: Lowe's. It's actually called "Maxi-Rack". Back in the old days it was Gorilla Rack. I'm kind of partial to industrial looking stuff and these are great.

I have one shelf that likely has 750+ lbs. aggregate on it, doesn't sag, whine or moan...

Bob G, potentially what you could do, if you are OK with the idea of setting your machine tools in one place and not moving them around is to have "pylons" built in to the slab at the areas where the machine feet lie. It will promote cracking a little earlier, but it is after all concrete, it will crack eventually...

Mike

Re: New Garage! #284867 06/24/03 09:29 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,147
Ishikawa Offline OP
Body Damage is Cool
Thanks for the link Mike...those shelves look hella-beef. Just what I'm looking for...I think two of those will fit nicely.

Now, we've been talking alot about functionality...I'd like to change the conversation a little bit into Layout. What recommendations can be given for a workbench, where should you locate the air compressor / welder / drill press / etc. Should everything be mobile, or stationary in an ideal location?

I was considering about an 8ft. workbench....since I could get a 8' sheet of 1/4" metal fairly easy. My thought was that an 8' bench would be pretty perfect for overall functionality of a good amount of workspace, while allowing me to possibly mount casters to the bottom and roll it into the driveway for those LARGE weekend projects. Then again, casters may negate the benefit of a good bench...what do you think? Perhaps a 6' bench is good enough? Maybe I need 10'?

Any other storage ideas?

Max

Re: New Garage! #284868 06/30/03 01:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,748
Dandeman Offline
Toyota Moderator
I got casters on my welding table shown above... I love being able to move the table around depending on what I'm working on...

but.... you need to either get casters with wheel brakes or make your own some how as you don't want the table rolling around while you're working on it... I have two casters that swivel and free to roll and two others that I locked in place (welded) so they can't swivel and the brakes are on those two wheels.

Given the weight of the table, two wheels locked is more than enough to keep it from moving around....

The 1/4" plate surface is perfect for a welding table.. or anything needing tweaking with a BFH.. Make sure you have a big vice on it.. and at the back of the table recommend you have a vertical piece of 1/4" plate lined up perfectly at 90 degrees for accurately clamping stuff to for welding..

Re: New Garage! [Re: Dandeman] #284869 10/23/03 07:54 PM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Thought I would add a few odd cents into the discussion. I have been building a garage/workshop for myself. Doing nearly all of the construction myself (from the foundation up) in order to afford it. In all, it is roughly 1500 s.f. -- 900 s.f. garage / workshop downstairs and 600 s.f. woodshop upstairs. I'll mainly present the downstairs for this discussion since that is where the automotive / metalworking is done.

First, if you have the option, go with a detached garage. Then you don't have the noise, dust, and dirt connected to the house. The significant other will love you for it! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

For electric, I had a 200 amp service to the original house. I had the electric company upgrade the service to 400 amp (they call it a Class 320 service) and then split the service to run to the 200 amp panel in the house and a second 200 amp panel in the garage. Best decision that I ever made. I put 20 amp receptacles about every six feet so that one is always handy. Also ran 220V around and just have blank plates over the electrical boxes for any future needs. There is a 220V by the overhead door for stick welding outside. With the 200 amp panel, I have more than enough circuits out there for everything.

I painted the floors with a industrial two part epoxy system from Rustoleum. As was mentioned, welding can be an issue. I have a few little round burn marks where globs of molten metal fell. I have since bought a welding blanket from Harbor Freight and that seems to be the ticket for protecting the floor. There are some scuff marks here and there, but I have drug stuff across it and driven my Bobcat skid loader in there and spun around a few times as well. Only real problem is a couple places that water has gotten under the epoxy paint and lifted it right off the concrete. One spot was near the man door where water leaked in under the door. The other place was at a side wall where water got in. Both places I have corrected the leaks, just a matter of getting some more paint and touching it up.

I went the extra distance and drywalled the interior. Some may consider that a luxury, but I consider it a good investment. First, it regularly gets down into the 20s in the winter here and does drop below zero. So I insulated the garage. The kraft paper on batt insulation is coated with tar, so it burns. Drywall is a fire barrier. I went with 5/8" drywall, which is fire rated but also is much more impact resistant than 1/2". Don't even consider 3/8" drywall. Cold may not be as much of an issue in Texas, but perhaps it would keep the heat down as well?

Painting the drywall a light color does wonders for brightening up the shop. I've spent too much time in dingy dark basements and garages without adequate lighting.

Which brings me to the next topic. Lighting. I went with 8' high output cold weather fluorescent fixtures. Lights the shop up better than daylight. As I said, it gets cold around here, so I needed the cold weather ballasts -- good down to about -20F -- otherwise the tubes just flicker in the winter. I have the switches for these lights at the back of the garage, away from the doors. They only get turned on if you are working since it takes them awhile to fully warm up. You don't want to flip them on for just a few moments. The switch at the door turns on a separate circuit of a few incandescent fixtures spaced around the first floor to just give a good general, overall lighting. That way you are not flipping on the big guns just to find a screwdriver for a project back at the house.

The garage space is divided in half. One side has two "drive in" bays with separate garage doors. The floor slab in those bays slopes back towards the door so that rain / snow / slush falls off the vehicles and drains back out the door. The other half is level so that you have a surface to work on without things rolling around.

My ceilings are 10.5 feet, but I wish that I had gone higher (12' or so) so that I could put in one of those lifts eventually. The truck is not a problem to get under <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />, but the cars are a bit of a pain...

For heating on the first floor, there is radiant tubing under the slab. The eventual plan is to put in a boiler and have radiant slab heating on the first floor and radiant baseboard on the second floor.

There is a stationary compressor that will be plumbed throughout the building. Centralized dust collector on the second floor, but I had not thought of the shop vac system on the first floor. Have to look into that.

Right now, storage is mainly industrial metal shelving and cabinets that I scored from the local kitchen remodeler. When they redo a kitchen, they pull out all the old cabinets, cart them back to their shop, and leave them in the alley. When they have a slow moment, they bust them up and chuck them in their dumpster. If any of the cabinets walk off before they bust them up, less work for them. These are not pretty cabinets, but most of them are solid wood and plywood from the days before everything was made of particle board. You're not going to store third members and transfer cases in them, but they are fairly heavy duty and FREE!

Right now I am finishing up the drywall and starting in on the ceilings. Then just a matter of getting all the receptacles and light fixtures in. Been working on it for years. Had to put it on hold for awhile while life took some unexpected turns.

The disclaimer. I've spent my life working for architects, engineers, and contractors. Right now I am working on getting my architecture license. I realize that not everybody would have the inclination to do this, but for me it is part therapy, part quest. If I could make a living designing and building ultimate garages and workshops for people it would sure beat the speculative offices and other unimaginative projects I am working on now!<img src="/forums/images/graemlins/sleeping.gif" alt="" />

If anyone is interested, PM me and I'll send you a couple pictures.

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