Maybe he meant the carrier bearings. If a shop disasembles a front dif, or any diff, I gather they need to reinsatll and reassemble it correctly. Fluid, seals, tolerances. If they trash the bearings, they are on the hook for their replacement. The shop that did my ARB wasted the bearings. They also overfilled the diff, way over. The seals were not set correctly. They stood up and replaced and made good. Jiffy Lubes buy new car engines all the time when they are technically incompetent. Just as a brake or wheel shop does when they send a customer off the lot missing lug nuts and the car rolls over. Ask me how I know. Understand that if you dont have a garage full of tools, and or your rig is also your only means of transportation, you cant leave it lying around in pieces waiting for parts or friends to help out. You have to trust and rely on those with whom you do business.

Lil-uzi-

That is great, but we need to differentiate incompetence and owner neglect. If a shop screws up, then they need to fix the problem. If an owner does not do what is reasonably expected of them (checking oil, tire pressure whatever (this means they do it themselves or have someone do it for them)), then the shop is not at fault.

If Jiffy Lube screws up (an they do, I just used them as an example, but you can insert your favorite shop if it makes you feel better) then they should be held liable. But, if a shop does everything right, it is wrong and unfair to blame them for what they are not responsible for. That is what the above is all about.

It also does not matter if you have the tools or take it to the shop. I know there are people who do not have the space/time/tools to their own work. That's fine. But, if they have speciality items, like an ARB, installed, then they better have the gumption to lay on the ground in the parking lot and check fluid levels. A bit of preventative maintenance goes a long way. In the case above, it would have saved a big repair bill.

Michael

I definitely agree with Mr. Clark on this one. Really, after 6 months theres no way to say that they did or did not fill the diff correctly there are just too many variables and way too much time. You shouldn't have to check over a shops work after its done, I know i dont have time to, but you certainly should be checking your fluids more often than every 6 months. Hell when I got my ARB installed they told me I should change the fluid after 300 miles, last time I checked the average person puts more than that on their vehicle in a week, much less 6 months. As much as I like to trash on 4wheel parts, they aren't in the wrong on this one.

Dallas

My local mechanic found that the diffy fluid was about 1 qt. low when he checked out the noise problem. There is no doubt in my mind they didn't put enough diffy fluid back in when completing the install.

I am assuming this statement is correct. IN GENERAL I think someone would notice losing a quart out of the diff via a puddle in the driveway. (Before we go technical and drag away the main point, no I don't think it dumped a full qt at once in the driveway, but that you would notice some drips and would investigate).

Do I know everything that was involved? No. But neither does anyone else who replied. So, given the following:
1. The facts we have û a vehicle damaged and a differential a quart low.
2. An assumption that the owner was reasonably intelligentùie. if they saw any drips on it or the driveway and would check it out.
3. An assumption the mechanic was reasonably intelligent and looked for some tell-tale signs of a six month leakà..like moist oil, or caked oil and dirt instead of a clean diff.
4. And the remote possibility that the diff was filled but not enough to clear a "bubble" out of the system...say if the SUV was leaning on the lift
5. We can reasonably assume that most differentials, when sealed, hold their fluid pretty well and don't need to be checked every month (Your rig may--and from your comment seems to--vary..... <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> but I only check mine every 30k)

It is not certain that the shop messed up, but there is the possibility. By the rules of the board, this person posted his personal story.

Or let me phrase it your wayùif you pay Jiff-Wal-Lube to change your oil, your statement says they are only responsible to drain the oil and replace the filter. It's up to you to verify they put new oil in there. If you don't catch it until you drive home or a week later (if it was a few quarts low) and the engine seizes, it's your fault and your problemùdeal with it. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />

I think our difference is I'm assuming the owner and mechanic are honest and reasonably intelligent, and that a shop might, just might make a minor mistake. I know, it's never happened before in the history or auto maintenance, but do humor me that it might occur (sarcasm alert)

And I've seen moderator posts that were blunt and not rude. *My opinion*, the above was again outside the normal "blunt" lines and general good courtesy I usually see here.

This is not meant to be an all-out CAPS argument, I just wanted to highlight the point of disagreement that I believe was missed.

Wayne

Disclamer:
I'm not a certyfied mechanic, i'm not assosiated with 4wheellparts, i'm not against anyone who posted above.

We don't know if the shop filled the diff, but we also can not be sure if they didn't (too much time had passed, i mean 6 months without checking the oil level?).

All i know is what i have experienced first hand, with my truck.

I have a friend in NY who owns a shop. I know everytime i go there to do something that i either have no tools for or the time to do it myself, the job will be done as good as if i was the one doing it (he is a good friend & i always tip the guys working there, a lot). But no matter how much i trust the guys, i always check whatever they worked on couple of days later, because a bolt might need to be retightened or the oil level checked, stuff like that (i know you can't check they work in this case, but simply checking the oil level is easy enought).

IIRC any gear install requires change of oil in between 500 & 1k miles anyway & if you didn't bother to even check the level on that thing within 6 MONTHS (and i'm sure you tup more than 1k miles on it) than it's your fault & not he shops.

Maybe they forgot to tell you the need to replace the oil afer certine timeframe, but you could never prove it.

Michael it was a little harsh the way you frased the post, but i would've frased it even wors (because of my lack of engilsh) & since we are unable to express exactly what we want most of the time (this is internet don't forget) it was taken the wrong way. I'm sure you didn't mean to sound the way others enterpreted (you've moderated me a fiew times before <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/shiner.gif" alt="" />).

But i'm not down with name calling either. If you had a problem with Michael you shold've PM'd him.

Just my $.02 on this

rubo

I will add my .02 here just because I happen to have .02.

Most of the people that go to the "Juicy Lube" type places do not have the aptitude to turn wrenches on their own vehicles. By the same token, most of the employees at those places are high school kids and are not qualified to work on cars either. All they do is follow directions. take this wrench, remove this bolt, unscrew this miniture trash can looking thing, wipe off the engine, screw on a new trash can looking thingie, and call it good...

If anyone comes in with anything other than a bone stock late model car, they do not know what they are doing.

This is exactly why these places have a contract with a local shop to do engine replacements. They WILL screw something up. I had a friend that worked at such a shop, and he did at least 1 to 2 motor replacements a month for the "lube" shop. They are notorious for leaving out fill plugs, wrong filters, under filling with fluids and so on.

IMHO, it is not hard to change fluids, and as a car owner, you should be checking everything out on your own. When you change your iol, tou should also check your tranny fluid, and diff fluid levels. It only takes a few minutes to do, and it will save a lot of trouble later.

If you take your rig in for some work, it should always be checked when you leave, whether you can do it yourself, or if you have to have someone else check it out for you.

Hey... maybe I should go in to Jiffy Lube and have them change my transmission oil... sooner otlater they are bound to leave a plug out and blow it up... Hmmm... cheap way to get a new tranny??? LOL!

My local mechanic found that the diffy fluid was about 1 qt. low when he checked out the noise problem. There is no doubt in my mind they didn't put enough diffy fluid back in when completing the install.

Wayne, we are just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. The above statement does not mean anything. Let's look at it logically. Why would a shop only partially fill a diff? It is ridiculous to assume they did. Yes, it could happen, but I doubt it.

Putting the blame on the shop is easier than claiming 90wt eating aliens came in the night and sucked the life blood of his front diff. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> It is also much easier to swallow than, heaven forbid, taking the responsibility that he had not checked the fluid (or changed it should have been) before 6 months down the road.

You seem to also miss the point about getting your oil changed, and it applies to this too. If he had checked fluid levels after the install (we are going to assume that with an ARB, he wheels it and therefore fluid levels should be checked) and found it low, then he might have recourse against the shop or he could have just filled it up and saved the bearings. I don't care who does the work, when you drop $1000 into an axle, you check the fluid level after and periodically.

Take care,
Michael

Everyone gets your point why don't you just drop it. Surely you have something better to be doing than going back over this point by point.When something happens to a persons car or truck like that it is very upsetting especially when you just get it out of the shop.He wasn't attacking you personally.Just venting alittle.4 wheel parts is not immune to error and that is something I do know 1st hand. Lets all try to act like adults . <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/baby.gif" alt="" />

Txco-

Bottom line? If you don't like it, don't read it. Just like the TV, if you don't like what's on, change the channel.

This is why we are here. To discuss points. Part of this discussion process includes presenting differing view points, but so far, the differing view points have little to do with the actual thing that started the discussion. Yes, we should trust our mechanics 100%. Yes, we should expect to get what we pay for and yes, in a perfect world nothing would be our fault, only the fault of others. But it is not and there is shared responsibility. The shop does their work and the owner of a vehicle needs to maintain it (again, either themselves or by taking it somewhere on a regular basis).

That is the crux of this whole thing. What started this was a faulty accusation of a shop doing sub-par work. You may not like 4Wheel Parts or any other place for that matter, but it does not mean that someone can malign them willy-nilly. That is how we do things around here. First hand accruate knowledge coming from first hand experience. I have heard horror stories from 4WP, but...I have no direct dealings with them. Does this mean that every time someone accuses them of something, they are at fault? No.

As far as me having better things to do and taking it personally, you underestimate me. This is the Internet. Long ago I learned that there is nothing on here that I ever need to take personally. Just as what I type should not be taken personally by others. If they do, that is beyond my control.

Michael

I get all that,just maybe try to not be so pompus and people may respect your opinion a little more.