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starting hard in the morning on cold days #346763 11/13/03 02:55 PM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 73
Explorerguy Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
[color:"purple"]Anybody have an idea why our 95 Sportage starts hard in the mornings when it's cold?
I usually have to hold it to the floor and crank on it then when it sounds like it might start lift my foot about half throttle and then it usually starts.
The wife has a lot harder time with me and she is starting to get pissed off at the poor little Sportage....

Any help would be appreciated. [/color]


1994 Ford Explorer 5.5 Superlift, 35's no-slip in the rear, lots of custom parts ( sliders, tire rack & more)
2003 Kia Sorento
1987 Suzuki Samurai for our son and wife
Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days [Re: Explorerguy] #346764 11/13/03 04:37 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,497
Axe Man Offline
Kia Moderator Emeritus
Usually when you have to floor a fuel injected vehicle to get it to start that indicates that the engine somehow got flooded. At WOT (wide open throttle) while cranking the ECM will shutdown the fuel injectors to clear the engine of excess fuel. That could be one cause...

Another possibilty is that you are losing fuel prime due to either a fuel leak or a slowly failing fuel pump. The excessive crank time could be due to the fuel pump trying to re-prime the system. Here's how you can check this:

Tomorrow morning turn the key to "ON" and let it sit for 30 seconds before you crank the engine. If it starts immediately that tells me the fuel system is losing it's prime. If it still doesn't start and you have to floor the pedal then I would suspect something is causing the engine to flood. Diagnosing that is gonna take a fuel pressure gage and the fuel system section of the shop manual. If you want those files send me an e-mail at [email]mjats@juno.com.[/email]


1998 Sportage - Gone.
2004 Honda Civic Coupe.
2007 Suzuki Grand Vitara - She got it.
Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days [Re: Axe Man] #346765 11/13/03 07:18 PM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Mine has been doing something similar - seems to have started with the onset of cooler weather. When I start mine in the morning (no foot on pedal), it starts, but coughs and sputters for a few seconds....then it recovers and everything is fine afterwards...I was thinking this was low fuel pressure, perhaps as you indicated, losing it's prime.

I wonder if the fuel filter could be part of the problem...? although, if this was the case, I would expect the problems to be more prevelant.

Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days #346766 11/13/03 07:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,497
Axe Man Offline
Kia Moderator Emeritus
Quote
Mine has been doing something similar - seems to have started with the onset of cooler weather. When I start mine in the morning (no foot on pedal), it starts, but coughs and sputters for a few seconds....then it recovers and everything is fine afterwards...I was thinking this was low fuel pressure, perhaps as you indicated, losing it's prime.



No, your problem might be a dirty IAC (Idle Air Control) valve. It's located on the intake pipe that runs across the top of the engine, right side over the exhaust cam. It has the electical connector that faces straight up.

Remove the 2 screws securing the IAC to the intake pipe. Leave the electrical connector installed. Pull the IAC off the intake pipe carefully so you don't damage the gasket. Spray carb cleaner into both ports of the IAC. Also spray some into the ports in the intake pipe. Allow to dry for a few minutes and then re-install.

Another possibilty is the infamous mass airflow sensor wiring. But before going there try cleaning the IAC first.


1998 Sportage - Gone.
2004 Honda Civic Coupe.
2007 Suzuki Grand Vitara - She got it.
Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days [Re: Axe Man] #346767 11/13/03 07:54 PM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Axeman

Are we thinking of the same thing...? I am pretty sure I know what the IAC is - on mine, it mounts inside a bracket, and the connector faces sideways...I have two rubber hoses connected to each pipe, as you indicated...

On KiaUSAParts.com:
Kia USA Parts - Idle Control Valve

Can you please take a look at the above link, item #20 and confirm this is the same think...The IAC piece I am thinking of is what creates pressure when the throttle plates are closed. The way you described the mounting (or at least the way I interpreted the mounting), it doesn't sound the same.

If this is the correct part, I will try the carb cleaner trick. The car seems to idle like a dream once it gets past that initial 3 second blurb - never have problems afterwards. However, this does make sense if it initially sticks after sitting all night in the cold weather....once it opens, everything is great.

Thanks!

Kevin

Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days #346768 11/13/03 08:04 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,497
Axe Man Offline
Kia Moderator Emeritus
Quote
Axeman

Are we thinking of the same thing...? I am pretty sure I know what the IAC is - on mine, it mounts inside a bracket, and the connector faces sideways...I have two rubber hoses connected to each pipe, as you indicated...

On KiaUSAParts.com:
Kia USA Parts - Idle Control Valve

Can you please take a look at the above link, item #20 and confirm this is the same think...The IAC piece I am thinking of is what creates pressure when the throttle plates are closed. The way you described the mounting (or at least the way I interpreted the mounting), it doesn't sound the same.

If this is the correct part, I will try the carb cleaner trick. The car seems to idle like a dream once it gets past that initial 3 second blurb - never have problems afterwards. However, this does make sense if it initially sticks after sitting all night in the cold weather....once it opens, everything is great.

Thanks!

Kevin


Oh wow...I didn't realize on the 1996 that the IAC was right next to the throttle body. Item #20 as you indicated. It's much different on later models. It still might be worth the effort to try to clean it.


1998 Sportage - Gone.
2004 Honda Civic Coupe.
2007 Suzuki Grand Vitara - She got it.
Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days [Re: Axe Man] #346769 11/14/03 03:52 PM
Anonymous
Unregistered
I havent had time as of yet to clean out the IAC...However, this morning, I tried your trick of turning on the ignition for about 30 seconds before attempting to start - started up no problems - the first time in the last two weeks!

I have gone through the MAF issues and have rewired everything....typically, the MAF caused idle problems all the time (intermittent), as did the TPS connector (mine are soldered like yours, including the temp sensor by the radiator). This little incident only occurs for 2 seconds in the AM when the car has been sitting all night - once it gets past the stumble, it runs perfect all day. It even starts up fine after sitting several hours during the day (get to work @ 8, leave at 5 - no issues).

I plan to clean out the IAC, as you suggested as well. Would leaving the ignition on for about 30 seconds before starting "prep" any other system other than the fuel pump...? Again, this definately worked - car started super clean - no hesitation.

Thanks.

Kevin

Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days #346770 11/15/03 12:14 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,497
Axe Man Offline
Kia Moderator Emeritus
No, nothing else gets "primed" other than the fuel system. My thoughts mirror yours. Perhaps changing the fuel filter would help, along with cleaning the IAC.


1998 Sportage - Gone.
2004 Honda Civic Coupe.
2007 Suzuki Grand Vitara - She got it.
Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days [Re: Axe Man] #346771 11/15/03 07:54 PM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 73
Explorerguy Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
[color:"purple"]Yesterday I tried the trick wait 30 sec before starting it and when I tried turned it over it tried one time to start and that was it, then I waited another 10 seconds and it started right up. Today I tried it again and it did the same thing, almost started but didn't so I wait 10 sec and nothing just crank, crank, so I put the pedal about half way down and it finally started.
i'll try again tomorrow and see but so far it isn't working like it should. [/color]


1994 Ford Explorer 5.5 Superlift, 35's no-slip in the rear, lots of custom parts ( sliders, tire rack & more)
2003 Kia Sorento
1987 Suzuki Samurai for our son and wife
Re: starting hard in the morning on cold days [Re: Axe Man] #346772 11/16/03 04:49 AM
Anonymous
Unregistered
LEaving the ignition on for 20 seconds before starting has definately resolved the starting issue. I plan to replace the fuel filter and see if I can find other leaks...this is a minor problem - I'll wait until the fuel pump dies before I replace...

I did clean the IAC - this didn't solve the cold start issue. However......I am AMAZED! My Sportage has always idled well - or at least I thought! It has never been SUPER smooth - but I was always happy once I fixed the MAF and TPS issues - never stumbled or died. After cleaning the IAC, I cranked it up and let her warm up...I sat in the car and couldn't hardly tell the engine was running - unbelievable difference! I took the liberty of cleaning out the throttle body as well while I was taking things apart....the difference is 100000000%!

Now if the fuel filter solves the fuel pressure issue, I will be even happier! I also have a 97 Tahoe...and if I let it sit a few days, when you initially start, the starter has to run 3-4 seconds versus an instant startup. When I turn on the ignition prior to starting, you can hear the fuel pump pressurize the lines...although, my Tahoe doesn't stumble at all - just cranks for a few seconds longer.

Thanks for the tip!


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