wow, i like the torque spec on the 3.0l

Considering that EPA & DOT rules keep getting more strict and the greenies want to put us on bicycles, don't get your hopes up about to many diesels hitting the market. Keeping in mind also that if soccer mom's don't like it and it doesn't ride like a luxury sedan (read NO live axles). Then you won't see it in the U.S.. Also the idea of things like selectable lockers from the factory ain't going to happen in this Lawsuit Happy Country <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/ignore.gif" alt="" />

Well, that's one way to look at it. I like the more positive outlook:

1. It was a republican president (typically not the first choice of the Green party) who recognized diesels are becoming more popular...and he likes them. He saw they're not just out on the farms or remote highways (construction equipment) any more (trains are affected, too). As a result, the right-leaning, pro-business president personally crusaded for clean-burning diesel to stimulate that. More diesels, less pollution. And you see this as a bad thing?

2. As gas becomes more expensive, diesel and bio-diesel become more and more attractive. There are even turbo-diesel hybrids out there now, in both commercial, military, and potentially full-production civilian applications (take the ground based rader and machine gun off the military DuraMax model). And more bio-diesel helps the American farmers as well as they grow the crops for it. Again, I don't see this as a negative.

3. If it wasn't for soccer moms, we wouldn't have so many models to choose (and get spare parts) from. Of course, if you want to make it full 4WD, you have to swap a front axle. How bad is that? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/drunk.gif" alt="" /> But if it wasn't for soccer mom's, the only 4x4 off-road vehicle you would have a choice on would be which model of bleet(*)...I mean Jeep....is your favorite!

[color:"#666666"](*) Sheep noise, for those who don't get it.[/color]

4. Uh...factory lockers do happen. The Jeep Rubicon. The Jeep Scrambler...ur, I mean Unlimited Rubicon. Hummer, I believe, and I think there's one or two more doing it (American) but I can't remember where I read it. Some help here?

5. Every year we have more passenger vehicles with standard/optional diesel engines over here in the USA as the Big 3 (domestic) and Big 3 (foreign) recognize the potential once the clean diesel hits America and jockey for position.

6. Yeah, those greenies are shutting us down. That explains the explosion for just a few to over 50 SUV's in the last decade, including the new class of "over 6k" that are so big, they aren't SUV's, they classed as farm or construction equipment. Let greenies convince half the population to ride their bikes, it keeps gas cheaper for the rest of us. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/evil.gif" alt="" />

Pop over to the Isuzu Diesel Board and look over some of the last year's posts. More and more good news coming out on diesels every year. There's a great post (see TD-hybrid link above) on city buses that get 50% more gas mileage than standard bus engines and, with clean burning diesel, would emit almost zero pollution. How's that for a great payoff?

Reminds me when a airhead blonde I was dating asked me how to make the seat slide back. (mind you I was driving about 45mph at the time). I said feel for a lever below the seat, she reached for the 4wd lever and said "this one?" I nearly had a heart attack... <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/angry.gif" alt="" />

We're treading a pretty narrow line with this post, which is on-topic only that it looks a lot like a Trooper, and we wish Isuzu would make one... let's all be careful with political discussions and phrases like "closet hard-core right-winger." <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/ignore.gif" alt="" /> I care deeply about what's happening in the government, and how that trickles down to us Isuzu 'wheelers, but I have to keep the two separate, otherwise I get too wrapped up in the candidate's or parties' stance on opposing issues.

Help me stay out of that political quagmire, 'K? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/baby.gif" alt="" />

That said, we can still talk about the underlying technologies... I can't really see much of a down-side to cleaner burning engines of any ilk, especially ones with technology that can be scaled up to more industrial powerplants, or even stationary emitters. Since we currently pay farmers NOT to grow some crops, it sure would be cool to pay them to farm some of the constituent elements of biodiesel... reducing foreign oil dependency in the process. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />

Factory lockers have a long history... you can go big with a Unimog or Volver medium-duty truck, or look at the Gov-Lock in older GMs. Newer GMs sport an available e-lcoker? option on light-duty industrial trucks, and Toyota has had an e-locker available for quite some time in mini-trucks, 4-runners, and the bigger late-model Land Cruisers (both axles on this last one!). IIRC, Mitsubishi also had some form of mechanical locker, though I can't remember what technology it used. Of course, in heavy trucks, selectable lockers have been around for decades... you couldn't get beer delivered in the mountains without 'em. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/drunk.gif" alt="" />

Rambling a bit (just NOT politically!),

Randii

Duly (and indeed properly) edited. Rant factor reduced 37%. Not my opinion, but I should know better than to take information from the internet during election year or get wound up by a post. Took the 'worst case' to to show it's not so easy to label, and to counter some of the previous post. For the record, I'm not a dem, repub, or green, but an actual independant.

There's no graemlin with a dope slap down there, is there?

you know, Wayne, with the current pace, we will have generally available and affordable diesel vehicle, here in USA, right in the moment of time when the oil is going to be prohibitantly expensive and we will have to switch to bicyles, to public transportation and to the horses.

I was going thru some articles and researches regarding the trends in the oil assets (like in National Geographic) and the trends in the oil consumtion (like China annual grows reports), and I made my opinion that by 2010, anyway, SUVs and trucks are going to be kind of toys for rich guys, like yachts. We have about 5 years to enjoy our vehicles. After that, you are no longer supposed to make to Moab unless you are an executive president. By that time, nobody will care about diesels. I hope I'll own a house by that time - I'll need a place to keep my horses.

to moderators: I am sorry for my next passage but I have to say it. Edit it if this is inappropriate:
I tweaked this because it was BARELY out of line, but out of line nonetheless after a warning. Thanks for flagging it for my attention. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> FWIW, I agree, Oleg, but I'm trimming it to avoid drawing other folks into further political discussions, which we have found to be catalysts for chaos on the boards. -- Randii

Oleg

There are other options.
GM talked about fuel cells in 2002. In 2004, they now have a working model.

I presume they will be able to scale them up to monster power. Invest in hydrogen!

Then there's the other end. Invest in air!
http://www.theaircar.com/
A solar powered air compressor would be a Moab essential--and replace the sun-roof with a solar roof. Speaking of which, there's always electric cars, though unless there's another option to the hydrogen fuel cell, battery power density seems to have hit a fixed limit.

Either way, the chief complaint/drawback to larger vehicles seems to be how much fuel they use. If we get a less expensive and reliable alternate power source for vehicles, expect *MORE* suv's, not less.

I'd love a turbo-diesel hybid or turbo-diesel fuel-cell engine and would plop an extra 1k down for it. 2k is pushing it, unless it has a high reliability (which it should since you always operate the mechanical engine at it's peak efficiency point instead of spooling up and down like a regular engine).

surely cheap new energy is good. But we need also an infrustructure and volume to make a new energy source usable by the mass consumer. This infrastructure will cost a lot. To get it by 2010, the country needs to start invest in it right now, and not just miserable 2 billions per year in the current budget.

I still don't understand why they don't engineer motors for alcohol. Burns cleaner for emissions and its free...someone educate me. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/baby.gif" alt="" />