I'm like Chili Man on this--

Simple to work on; cheap to rebuild.

Local machine shop here will rebuild a long block 22Rxx for $1500, the 3.0 for $3000.

Been dragging around a 16 ft boat with 35 hp motor for a few years now; got a couple of steep hills, but is okay.

You're comparing a modified 22RE to a stock 3.0 and that is not a straight up comparison. For every dollar you put into a 22RE, the same amount put into a 3.0 will still give it more power and torque and be a more drivable engine day to day. Ivan Stewart raced the 3.0 for years and made tones of power. If money is no object, then drop an LT1 Corvette motor in your 4Runner and never look back. There's a rational limit to how far you can go with either a 22RE or 3.0 and still be emissions legal for daily driving. So asking which engine is better is a moot point. What do you plan to do with your next vehicle? Rock crawling, towing a 1000 lb boat, 50 mile commute each way? Personally, a supercharged 3.4 Toyota swap would be the best solution to keep it all Toyota.

Not quite. For one thing, you can't touch Ivan's motor for what we all have in our bank accounts put together I should think. I do NOT know, but would be willing to wager, that Ivan's heads are not very much like any of our 3.0s are/were, thereby fixing the major 3.0 problem. $$$$$! Also, for every dollar put into modifying a 22RE, it takes two dollars into a 3.0 to produce half the result on a percentage basis. Those who have mildly modified 3.0s on this board have been disappointed, while the similar level of modification on a 22RE satisfies - and is cheaper to boot.

Out of the scope of the question though.

Agreed, the use is the determiner. And also agreed, the 3.4 (even normally aspirated) fixes all the 3.0's problems, every one. But its out of the scope of the question.

Other than a few guys who supply hotter cams for the 3.0L (can count the sources on one hand thats missing 3 fingers) I thought the only "power parts" hehehe were them there free flowing fill your crankcase with dirt airfilters and cold air intakes. Maybe Im wrong though....

I am fortunate enough to have a slightly groomed 22R-E...ok so thats an understatment. I have 2 massaged 22R-Es. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Im quite content with being able to haul an 18' Alumaweld up and down hills all day long without having to downshift into 2nd gear...plus I get awesome gas mileage. If the 3.0L is soooo great...why does almost everyone here with a 3.0L dream of swapping to the 3.4L???

Just my opinion man.....

22R-Es rule and 3.0Ls drool. (I think thats how it goes...but then again I thought being called a cracker by son's girlfriend was cool too). <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

~Darin <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/baby.gif" alt="" />

Notice that you are all talking about modifying the 22RE. Let's pretend he has no money left after buying this new vehicle. I think the 3.0 would be the better choice because it has more power and torque. If you say he has money to modify the vehicle, then you need to specify how much money is available to modify with. That changes the initial question. How much $$$ does it take to put into a 22RE for it to match the output of the 3.0? $500, $1000, $1500? He needs to clarify his question better or none of us can help him.

As a side note, my 87 turbo 4Runner was better than my 3.0 trucks. I took a little time and ported the exhaust manifold and turbo exhaust housing to open them up to flow better and that truck kicked butt after that. No cost other than the $2.50 grinding stone from the hardware store. When that truck spooled up it would outpull the 3.0 easily. But it also got 14 mpg in the process, so much for 4 cyl fuel mileage.

I think we are all spotting the 3.0 some power stock, in a stock truck (not 90-95 4Runner). It worked really well in my XtraCab, and I even thought about buying another. Briefly. Headgaskets and maintenance costs (rebuilding) notwithstanding.

I was just exploring the possibilities for modification and maintenance each engine offered- or doesn't. Not that any of us modify anything, stocker jockeys that we are... <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/shiner.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

Two reasons to get the 3.0:

(1) Reliability is ever-bit as good as the 22R-E (I've had both)

(2) the 3.0 makes more torque at 1200 RPMs than the 22R-E makes at its peak.

Here's the chart everyone loves to hate:


The icing on the cake is the 3.0 is considerably smoother and quieter than the 4 cyl. You can use it like a truck. The 4 cyl lacked the power for hauling loads and towing.

Downside? The engine bay is cramped.

i have to disagree with this. i have a 94 truck with the 22RE. i've had well over the stated 1/2 ton capacity in the bed several times <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/ignore.gif" alt="" /> and never had any problem with having enough power to haul it. and that includes up (and down) some long steep hills (as pittsburgh is all hills).

i've never driven a 3.0 (have driven a 3.4, though...it has waaaayyy more power than the 22RE), so i cannot comment on the comparison. however, i can say that i have never felt my truck to be underpowered with the unmodified (except for some carbon build up that has pushed the cylinder compression up to 185psi <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/notooth.gif" alt="" />) 22RE.

i mean, i'm not gonna win any drag races against a hemi or anything. i can, however, accelerate plenty fast enough to merge onto a highway. (and go rescue the broken down hemi owner <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />)

as far as power to haul a heavy load up a steep hill, though, i have no complaints at all.

I'm curious why people consider the 3.0 inheritently unreliable just because of the HG issue? What about the 22r's propencity to break timing chain guides? Or the fact that the 22r's are interference where the 3.0 is not?

I've owned many of both. I like both. I think the 3.0 gets a bad wrap, personally. The 22re is easier to work on, the 3.0 has more power. My biggest complaint about the 3.0 is the location of the oil filter - and that complaint carries over into the 3.4 as well.