I think MY 4x4 is the BEST because I own it. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/baby.gif" alt="" />

Overall Moab is priety easy wheeling, other then the above mentioned which I have done in my 90 Montero.(Except Upper Helldorado)I will challenge anyone here for amount of wheeling done in Utah though!)

I issue a challenge to any Jeep owner here, join the annual Sierra Challenge I sponsor. I now allow any make. Its August 5-13(wheeling days). We start at Barrett, then Rubicon, then Barker Meadow, followed by Fordyce, and trails in the gold lake region.(VERY FEW attempt this link of Sierra trail due to difficulty) If your Jeep is not broken, and is still running by the end of the trip, you can stand that many days in a Jeep and you can pack supplies for the entire trip, I will fill your tank up at the end. To make it interesting, I will insure atleast 1 Gen II Montero completely stock except for 33s and sliders shows up.(not hard because atleast one always comes) NOW, I would ask for a stock Jeep of that era for comparison, but it would take too long to drag it through <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />
If you have not done Fordyce yet, your in for a treat. May not be wrecking ball, choke cherry, tobasco twister, trail 11 helicopter pad or Isham, but the shear length of these trails test overall indurance well.
Myself? The new Gen III Monteros are crappy and I will be going to an Xterra next with off-road package. Is that the best ever built? Doubt it, but then I dont have 75K for a G Wagon, nor will my family fit in a Rubicon, even stretched for 10days on the trail.....

sure, yall can come over here together and rag jeep while i'm working, but in another month when i'm wheelin' with the top and doors off and you're jamin' the a/c with the windows up we'll see whos having more fun!!! enjoy your imports <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/patriot.gif" alt="" />

we do enjoy our imports... and I don't use my A/C because opening the rear sliders and the other 2 windows works fine for me. and I don't have to tie down everything I don't want flying out of my rig when I am on the streets. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'm seeing a lot of good facts and opinions (some very BAD opinions as well) being thrown around. What we need to do is come to a unanimous definition of what makes a 4x4 good, not opinions or mine is best because its mine or I wheel in it a lot, but what really what makes a good 4x4. Once we have a universal definition of what a good 4x4 is, we can start comparing the FACTS of what all our 4x4 have and make a conclusion on what is the best 4x4. I believe this is how most magazines or TV shows do it, no reason why we can't either.

On a side note, NO FURTHER PERSONAL ATTACKS WILL BE TOLLERATED. It's going to far when we call each their names. Come on Jeepers; letÆs quell this rumor that we are obtuse ignoramuses.

Here is what I think makes a good 4x4.

1. It needs to have decent safety measure. IE roll bars/cage or metal top.

2. It needs to be easily modified. Everybody modifies their rig.

3. It needs to be able to accept big tires.

4. It needs a strong driveline to take big tires and the beating off-road.

5. It needs to flex well. I have seen trucks on 38's get stuck in ruts because it couldn't flex through them.

6. Comfort is a plus but not too much is needed on a 4x4. A good seat with nice padding, leather might be asking too much..

7. It needs enough horsepower to clime hills and get through mud, but it would be nice if it doesn't take a full tank of gas out on a long trail....

8. Good aftermarket parts availability is a must. As said before, we all modify. It sucks to have to fabricate everything.

What else is a must? What isn't a must?
Lets get this list built then show where our rigs shine.

Good luck, because imo therein lies the problem to your solution.

Have you ever seen a statue of a committee in the park?

Usually it's just one man on a horse.

Frank <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />

I would put price in the mix as well. What good is the ultimate 4X4 if the average working man can't afford to buy it, or is too afraid to wheel it because of the monthly payments?

I personally love my Jeep. I have been through mud and sand in it and climbed a few rocks in it. I have done 4 hour road trips in it with wife, kids and gear for a weekend. Sure, it gets cramped, but like I tell the family, "It's a Jeep thing, get over it" <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/nana.gif" alt="" />

It sure is nice to get off work and decide that it is a nice day so I think that I will drop the top. Gets plenty of looks from other employees.

as far as a "standardized platform that you can buy fully built and turn-key" how about the Scorpion MkIV? Foers Ibex? later model Nissan Patrol? Does the AEV Brute count? (i know it's a TJ with mods) I've even seen 80's vintage VW Syncro vans that, right out of the factory are remarkably versatile. The FZJ70 is totally rad.

Personally I'm stoked about anything versatile, even if it's not the most brutal rock crawler on earth.

<img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> I guess the panty raid from the mitsu house is over! I think it was great fun! I think we also know it's all about brand loyality, we all can't seem to get passed this issue. I sincerely hope that no one took all this teasing seriously? If you did, we probably should talk about it . . . not!

I wish we had more comedians over here on the Jeep board to liven up things, now and then, the way the mitsu guys did this afternoon! ( I said comedians, not Canadians! But, then again, Canadians know how to party!) Someone mentioned rivalry this afternoon, I would hope this party resulted in some camaraderie between four wheelers that actually go offroad with there 4x4!

Lloyd, what a great idea to get a bunch of four wheelers to go four wheeling with you, the sierra challenge! What you're proposing is just the type of four wheeling I really like to do. But, I don't get that amount of time off.

Sunder, your post reminds me of a dad stopping a pillow fight between kids! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> No, I wouldn't say you are a wet blanket! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> Do you really believe anyone really wants to discuss "what is the best 4x4 ever built"? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> To make the analysis easy, I would suggest simply comparing various rigs against the Unimog, the stock rig that comes close should be the winner, just like in horseshoes, huh! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> It just doesn't matter! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> It's all about brand loyality, or what you purchased . . . this will never change! Wheel what you like, or wheel what you got! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

I honestly couldn't say what the best 4wd is, I have only driven a handful of them so I have no first hand experience with rigs like Jeeps, Scouts, Bronco's, 'Yotas and such. I know what I like for personal reasons, but the wheeling I do has little to do with the wheeling done in say SoCal or the midwest or the south. My choice really works for me, and I'm sure the same goes for Jeepers and all other folks who wheel. I'm glad the folks I wheel with all run different rigs, it's fun to see what setup works for certain kinds of obstacles. I've been on both ends of a towstrap pulling and getting pulled by alot of different trucks. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />

Brand loyalty? leave that to the Chevy and Ford guys. Let's wheel!!! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/patriot.gif" alt="" />