The D30 is a spindly little axle Sean it get's the credit it deserves...not much.

BTW a leaf sprung sas is a very simple thing to do. Been there, done that twice. Both times in a weekend. It doesn't take a genius...hell I did it <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/drunk.gif" alt="" />

What?.........Right, With a few mods such as a 3" suspension lift, the Jeep is more capable than a stock Amigo. If we want to compare, compare both in ther stock form. I'd say the Jeep has the edge. Now if you get into particulars;

Suspension Mods - There is more aftermarket by far for the Jeep, however it is pennies on the dollar to raise an Amigo compared to the Jeep.

Front Axle- As for the IFS versus Solid Axle it depends on what you intend on doing with it. The front axle on a Jeep is far more reliable than some folks give it credit here. I would say running 31" tires as you plan on doing the Jeep front axle is more reliable than the Isuzu IFS. Now if you think your going to slap 33" on the Jeeps stock front axle without issue's you've got something else coming. Then again the same lies true for the Isuzu IFS. As for trail breakage I would say that it's a whole lot easier to repair the Jeeps Solid axle as opposed to the IFS on the trail and this is coming form someone who just might have the record of repairing an Isuzu IFS on a trail or street for that matter.

Rear Axle - Isuzu has it hands down. The isuzu's D-44 axle can take up to 35" tires without merely an issue. You'll never pull that off in the stock Jeeps rear axle. Then again as you stated you're planning on only running 31". You will not have issue's with the Jeeps, although the Isuzu's is still superior. As for the extremely overly inflated claim as to how much it would cost to upgrade it to being comparably to the D44, reality is Warn has a 33 spline conversion (same as D44) for $900.00.

Flex - IFS............yeah right. Hands down the Jeep, and for a mere $5.00 worth of hardware at Lowes you can make your own sway bar quick disconnects and really get some flex.


Braking - Isuzu all the way, even though they both have disks on all four corners the Jeep is scary sometime trying to get it stopped due to the small size of the rotors and calipers.

Reliability - I can't speak for the Jeep on that yet being that I only have 4,000 miles on it but I can tell you my Isuzu experience was that I am now on my 3rd transmission and at approx 80,000 miles my 3.2 top end had to be rebuilt at the tune of $4,500.00 Now the Jeep could prove just as costly in time but I haven't experienced it so I don't know.

Gas mileage - Hands down the Isuzu. Stock I was getting 19 to 26 MPH. My Jeep gets 16 mph no matter what I do.

Interior comfort - Not sure, right now it's easily the Jeep but then again mines an unlimited so I don't have a bunch of hopping around plus the fact that I'm comparing new Jeep seating to beat to crap (almost 200,000 miles) Isuzu seating. The Isuzu is definitely quiter, that is until you put the mud tires on, then believe it or not the Jeep's quiter.

As for uniqueness - Ya, there are far less Isuzus that you see on the trail. However in the City there are few less Jeeps seen. I think uniqueness comes down to what you do with it in regards to mods.

AS for running in deep Snow and mud, if it were me I would go along with Strawmeyer, I wouldn't get either one of them and go with a full size pick up, more than likely a diesel Dodge Power Wagon.

If you have the tools and knowledge to do it maybe. I have welders and various metal working tools; you obviously must as well (or at least have access to them)... but a huge majority of the population does not.

The concept of a leaf-sprung SAS may be simple... but you have to consider it in terms of what he wants. A D44 can be swapped into the front of a Wrangler and retain the exact same ride height, wheel base, and steering as before. Which would be fine for the 31" tires he is talking about. Show me a SAS Amigo, using leaves that is appropriate for 31" tires and still functional. SOA is going to provide way too much lift. SUA with the shackles up front would still probably be too tall; but even if not, there is the extra issue of working out steering and you have rock-magnet shackles hanging down in front of everything. Spending the time and money on a SAS for a casual wheeler wanting to run 31's doesn't make much sense anyway.

To put a D44 under the Wrangler:
-unbolt D30
-set up mounting brackets on D44 to work with stock D30 susension
-bolt on D44
-may require regearing to match rear axle

For Amigo:
-cut off IFS and remove front drivetrain
-design entirely new front suspension and steering
-weld on mounting brackets for springs/shackles; probably requires extending the frame forward in the front as well
-get front D44, leaf springs, and shackles
-convert the rear to SOA leaves, or at least lift it a good amount to match the front (which is less than ideal with the stock links)
-make and put on steering components
-have new front driveshaft made
-definitely requires regearing to match the rear

There is no way to convince me that those are about the same amount of work, nowhere near the same cost, and either one is too much work for running 31's anyway.

Lets assume for a moment that the Isuzu IFS and D30 are the same strength. What about upgrading the stock components? DOR drop brackets are the best thing going for gaining back IFS reliability after a lift; and the most that you can hope for is OEM strength. The D30 has chromoly shafts and u-joints available. Sliding a set of upgraded axles and u-joints into a D30 is cheaper and easier than doing a SAS on an Amigo.

I understand wanting to think our trucks are the best. Obviously I have an appreciation for them since 2/3 of the vehicles I have owned have been Isuzus. But Joe shadetree mechanic can accomplish the same thing with a Wrangler using a socket set that it would take one of us, at minimum, decent welding skills to do safely. That doesn't make them better; but you have to look at your own individual skills and pocket book when starting from scratch and seeing where you want to end up. I still don't know how any of this makes sense for a guy wanting to run 31's, though <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

Well I must admit I currently own a 1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9 Limited and jeeps have there fair share of problems. Also from what i have saw wranglers seem kinda sad. What i thought was particularly sad was i crawled up this tall slippery hill in my bone stock zj compared to my friend with his 1994 yj with the swaybar and trackbars removed, had to get a running start and barely made it. All in all i will be glad getting rid of my ZJ and getting a amigo. Jeeps are for girls. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

Personally, I'm getting board with seeing so many Jeeps on the road. Every other vehicle is a Jeep of some sort. I like driving something "different".

As for the reliability - can't complain at all, I've had 2 Isuzu Rodeo's. Both seen upwards of 150k+ miles, with original engine (never opened), and original auto tranny (never opened).

One, the 1991 3.1L V6 was a 4x4; the other current Rodeo is a 1997 3.2L V6 4x2.

You see the description of a 4x2 and you immediately think nothing of it, granted, but this 4x2 has been in places where we only thought our 4x4 Rodeo could go. Both trucks visited their fair share of mud, sand, moderate sized rocks, heavy/steep muddy inclines. But we have not, and will not do any heavy rock crawling with this rig - so in that area, I can't say.

We like doing 4x4 trails, just not as hard core as we used to back in the 70's when we were kids bouncing in the back of our parent's 1970's Chevy truck's with the 350 engine. Don't have access to most of those trails now - and I remember my parents and ourselves spending many many hours on repairs from having done some pretty extreme stunts.

Both of the Rodeo's were maintained meticulously however, especially the auto tranny - it would get new fluid every 25-30k miles.

Don't remember the rear-end on the 91; but the 97 has the Dana 44 and running 32" shoes, now.

Not necessarily. Go ask the members on a Jeep board what they think of Isuzus. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> They'll undoubtedly have something to say... not a lot of which will be kind.



I just installed some adjustable Ranchos and OME 912s from Indy4x and am very satisfied with the results. I did have to do some fender trimming to get everything to fit, but it was minor and relatively easy to do.


As long as you check your oil once a month or so, as you should do for any car, it isn't an issue. Some people suggest adding a cleaning additive like Seafoam to the oil, then driving around for twenty minutes or so before changing the oil. I read that at least one member here cured his truck's oil consumption issues and nearly got rid of the valve noise that way. As for the intake gasket, I think it just deteriorates and eventually causes vacuum issues. If you're worried about it, swap it as soon as you get the vehicle.



Again, if you're attentive to the truck's maintenance needs, this won't be an issue. An oil change as soon as you purchase the truck , then another one at 500 or 1000 miles followed by regular three thousand mile oil changes (as well as checking oil levels once a month) is the surest way to be positive that everything works the way it's supposed to.

I wheel almost exclusively with jeeps, and the majority of those jeeps are wranglers, And even further, the majority of those wranglers are are the newer TJ's (coil sprung).

My Amigo has 33" tires, terra lows and a rear locker. As a general rule, I have no problems following a wrangler on 33's with a rear locker. Some obstacles maybe allow a slight advantage to one vehicle over another. More likely any differences in difficulty are a result of diffrences in driver ability. Let me say that again. As a general rule, The trail ability difference between a comparable Amigo and wrangler is a result of DRIVER ABILITY.

Each vehicle has its advantages and disadvantages. In Moab I took 3 adults and alot of gear on the trail in my Amigo, Thanks to considreable room behind the seat of an Amigo, which wranglers don't have (unlimited excluded).

The Solid axle in a wrangler also tends to plow through mud and snow, and generally be a low spot to catch on things. My IFS is considerably higher than a SFA, and can clear things, and stay out of the mud and snow (more so, not completely). Of course my alternator hangs low and doesn't like mud that well.

Amigos are heavier, wider and slightly longer than wranglers as well.

A final thing to consider is cost. When I bought my current Amigo, I also considred a Wrangler. To get a comparable age/mileage vehicle as my Amigo, the Jeep was considerably more. Enough more that after lift, terra's, a locker, new wheels and tires I still spent less than what I would have spent for a stock Wrangler.

I guess it all depends on what your final plan is. If you want 31-33's, go with what ever you want, they'll be about the same. When you start getting into tires in the 35" and over, then know the Amigo will probably cost more to build. If I were to build another trail vehicle and wanted to do it cheap, I would probably go for a 4cyl leaf sprung wrangler...they're dirt cheap, and I would be replacing most everyhting anyway.

regardless of what you end up with, your friends need to open their eyes, and realise that jeeps aren't the greatest things in the world. What you buy is only a foundation, eventually everything is going to be replaced any way.

Good Luck, and welcome to the world of wheeling.

-Mike

Apples and oranges... well, maybe apples and pears. Pick the fruit you like and go with it -- but realize that most of what you will hear is tinged by the person's experience. Though this isn't normally a bad thing, understand that brand loyalty to ANY brand often coincides with an incredible ability to see the upsides paired with a serious inability to see the downsides.
I've driven both, but really like the sporty handling of a second-gen Amigo. The TJ was a blast to go topless and doorless in, but stock-to-stock, I prefer the Amigo for its ability to throw down in the rocks and still clean-up and be civilized in the city. Of course, I like Isuzus, so see the last paragraph above. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

There have been some good threads on this over the years at 4x4Wire -- should make for some fun searching. Keep it a rational discussion, and we'll have more fun... remember, no name-calling or brand-bashing.

Randii

I cannot comment on a Amigo/Rodeo Sport in 4WD, my daughter has a 2001 Rodeo Sport 2WD, 2.2L, auto trans, hardtop, A/C. I love it, and have looked for a 4WD version of this for myself since last February. I owned two Jeeps when I bought the Isuzu for her, a 91 4.0L, auto, hardtop, A/C, tilt wheel and a 93 2.5L, five speed, A/C, convertible. I really enjoyed the Jeeps except for the ride, they beat my back to pieces. I sold them both in May and June, and bought a 1988 Dodge Raider as I still wanted a 4WD. The Raider is a SWB 2.6L, auto, LSD. It is actually more capable off road than the YJ's were, mostly due to the LSD. I believe if it were fuel injected rather than carbed it would be unstopable. My son has a 1994 4WD Nissan Pathfinder with 3.0L, auto trans, LSD and it has gone places that would of been a problem in either YJ. I like Jeeps, and drove DJ's for years at the USPS, but I really didn't like turning my two teenagers loose in them.

Does anyone have a Amigo/RS that is 4WD, 2.2L, auto or five speed? I find those cheaper than the V-6 models here in metro Atlanta. Fuel economy is more important than raw power to me, as I only use 4WD once every 4-6 weeks.

There's a bunch of 2.2 and 2.6 4x4's (like mine). Manual. If fuel efficiency is more important that raw power, this is definitly the engine combination for you! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/evil.gif" alt="" />

http://users4.ev1.net/%7Esanaghan/main/Vehicle/Index.htm
Hit the FAQ to see the engine/transmission combination. The 2.2 was manual only.