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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: bob large]
#753543
09/26/06 04:02 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 63
Getting the Wheeling Fever
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As you can see theres alot of carbon build up. Any ideas as to what caused it? Looks fairly normal, especially if you didn't have the rings properly broken in and set after the rebuild. A little Easy Off oven cleaner will take that right off the head, but DON'T leave it on, or else it can etch the aluminum. Just spray the cleaner off, let it bubble a bit, use a toothbrush to brush it a little bit, maybe a flexible paint scraper (nylon), they squirt it off with high pressure water or just plain old hose water with a good nozzle... works like a charm. I'm guessing that when you put a straight edge to the head it'll still be flat, and the valves still seal. If that is the case, I would pull the valve springs, then re-lap the valves with lapping compound and a lapping tool (suction cup on the end of a stick.) When you pull the block apart, you should probably leave the carbon on the sides of the pistons above the compression rings alone, and perhaps the carbon ring at the top of the cylinders if you can help it. There is no problem with taking the carbon off the tops of the pistons though. Hmmm... with only 4K on that rebuild something wasn't done right... some corner was cut, or not reassembled correctly. How much oil was it burning?
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: mlclark]
#753544
09/26/06 04:41 AM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,156
OP
Body Damage is Cool
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Ok, I added a pic of the oil pump I pulled out of the engine. I labeled it as ônew pumpö. The ôold pumpö is the one that came out of the original engine that had been in the amigo when I purchased it. The pic kind of sucks, since it doesnÆt show there wearing in either pump very well. But I added some arrows and text to highlight the important stuff. I didnÆt include any pics of the other parts of the pump because there wasnÆt any noticeable wearing on any of the parts. Ok so lets talk about the wearing on the pump. As you can see (kind of), there are some groves in the ônew pumpö. But there kind of small, so IÆm not sure what if anything it means. It might just be normal wear and tear to a pump. You tell me. The wearing is heavy at the top area, with some deeper groves. You can kind of see it in the pic. This is something that really sets the two pumps apart from each other. The ôold pumpÆsö wearing is very uniformed, while the ônew pumpö has all the wearing at the top. Again, IÆm not sure if this is normal or not. The pickup tube looked like it was seated perfect. And nope, no bearings, no metal shavings, no nothing in the oil pan. ![[Linked Image]](http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/2062/dcfcc00242po2.jpg)
Steve C
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: bob large]
#753545
09/26/06 04:46 AM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,156
OP
Body Damage is Cool
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How much oil was it burning? Not sure, I didn't really drive it enough to know. And I changed the oil a couple times after the rebuild. And as for the mileage, IÆm not really sure. It might have been 4k, or it might have been 2kà I'm guessing that when you put a straight edge to the head it'll still be flat, and the valves still seal. If that is the case, I would pull the valve springs, then re-lap the valves with lapping compound and a lapping tool (suction cup on the end of a stick.) I didn't rebuild the head, i had my local shop do it. So i'm not sure what they origonaly did. As for what ive done to it; nothing other than take a pic. I was just going to slap the head back on and try it out, but i also thought about purchasing a new head. But i really don't have the money. I'm a newb at this so any other thought would be helpfull. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />
Steve C
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: bob large]
#753546
09/26/06 05:03 AM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 7,268
Isuzu Moderator
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Did you pack the pump when you installed it? Assembly lube or petroleum jelly works. If not, I wonder if the scaring was from a dry start up.
I also wonder how flat the cover was. Was everything torqued equally?
As for the valves and head, i would not worry about it. The light white was probably from heat or lean. I doubt either was really a factor. What do the valve seats look like? Are the contact areas on the valves and head all about the same? As far as lapping valves, I would not touch it unless there seems to be some other problem. That head is pretty much fresh.
As for the block, while that wear on the pump is worry some, it would not make enough sound to explain what you heard over the sound of a running engine. The crank really turns over OK like?
Hmmmm, what did the pilot bearing look like? Can you spin the cam? Is there any debris on top of the head?
Just some ideas.
Michael
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: mlclark]
#753547
09/26/06 06:54 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 63
Getting the Wheeling Fever
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As for the valves and head, i would not worry about it. The light white was probably from heat or lean. I doubt either was really a factor. What do the valve seats look like? Are the contact areas on the valves and head all about the same? As far as lapping valves, I would not touch it unless there seems to be some other problem. That head is pretty much fresh.
I've always found it to be good practice to re-lap valves whenever I have a head off. Yes, it isn't strictly necessary, but then again it never hurts either. Some valves have replacable valve seals that I always replace for general purpose too (I'm not that familiar with the inards of the 2.6, never had mine apart any further than to check valve clearances when I owned one) With a head off, valves are really easy to dissassemble with a valve spring compression tool, available at Sears for like $20 - $30, or for rent. Just make sure that the valve goes back in exactly where it came from. This also allows you to inspect the valve seats and the clearance and runnout on the valve guides. Whatever you decide to do with the head, absolutely take a good, precision straight edge to it and ensure that it isn't warped. As for the noises you were hearing...hmmm crank end play? Main bearings or rod bearings...timing cam gear or chain?
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: Strider93]
#753548
09/26/06 07:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 279
Mudrunner
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Something that gets me about this and doesn't seem to fit in with a worn oil pump, or with a wiped out thrust bearing, is the need to keep it revved up quite a bit to keep it running with no load. I don't know where to point a finger, but this smacks of something simple. Broken cam or rocker???
Chris Enos (Chino, CA)
'91 Isuzu Amigo "Rover" (Camaro 3800 swap in progress / 2.25" exhaust) ....(SOA / Custom rear bumper / CB / HAM)
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: mlclark]
#753549
09/26/06 10:21 PM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,156
OP
Body Damage is Cool
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I wonder if the scaring was from a dry start up. Maybe, I didnÆt lube it. Was everything torqued equally? Yep I was careful of that. The crank really turns over OK like? Ya, just like butter. Hmmmm, what did the pilot bearing look like? Looks fine. Can you spin the cam? Is there any debris on top of the head? Well I pulled the cam out of the head way before I pulled the block out. So IÆm not sure. As for debris; yes and no. There was some black, non faris (I used a magnet), bits in the journals when I pulled it apart. But not a lot. Just some fine bits that had worked there way up, in and around the bolts of the journals. Again this really has me guessing. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
Steve C
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: FSJ1978]
#753550
09/26/06 10:23 PM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,156
OP
Body Damage is Cool
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Everything in the head looks fine. I havenÆt pulled the valve springs or valves out. Cuz I don't know how to do it. I'm guessing you need some sort of tool to compress the springs so you can take the works apart???
Steve C
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: FSJ1978]
#753551
09/26/06 10:25 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 681
Rock Warrior
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lest we not all forget, one of the things that was discovered was the fact that he couldn't get oil flow when spinning the oil pump with an electric drill... the issue was a "grinding" noise, and _not_ burning excess oil... that right there _should_ be one of the tells... but from the wear we are seeing in the pics, I don't see much evidence of low oil flow, do any of you?
There was no evidence of debris in any of the oil passages ?
Can ya blow air through all of them ?
<img src="/forums/images/graemlins/patriot.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />
C/YA! Jeff '88 Trooper 2DR LWB 4ZE1 5SP bone stock DD
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Re: The Second Time Around - 2.6l rebuild-
[Re: Troopersphere]
#753552
09/26/06 11:07 PM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 7,268
Isuzu Moderator
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For a head that has 2K or 4K miles on it, I would not touch it. More miles? Yeah, freshen it up. Unless there seems to be something visably wrong, it is not worth the time. That is just IMHO.
As far as oil passges, don't blow through them yet. Pull the two galley plugs at the end of the common galley. What's in there? I am wondering if in the cleaning process, all the crud did not get shoved in there. Pull the oil filter adapter too.
Michael
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