I did plan a tandem initially. I ran into problems with the numbers though after I weighed the Amigo:



Set up like this, I end up with just over 4% tongue weight. That seems like it'd be way more squirrly than a single axle with proper tongue weight. I can probably improve on that a little.

How much tongue weight does Wayne have? How long is the tongue? The Amigo is suprisingly even balanced. About 2100 on the front axle, 2000 on the rear. I might get a few % more on the tongue by shortening it and adjusting the deck a little bit.

Think a tandem will still be okay with a light tongue?

--Dan

Load that single axle seriously nose heavy to minimize transitionals, and I think you'll be fine (airbags on the tow wagon might help). Throw more tongue length on it than you need to damp any odd handling that may result from a heavy load, even in balance.

Go dually.
* $66.23 for 4 dually 16x6 6 on 3K-rated 6.5 rims: http://www.lowcosttrailersupplies.com/trailer-parts-oemdwr.html
* $333.95 for single 7K-rated axle with electric brakes: http://www.etrailerpart.com/7ktrailerAxle.htm
Lemme know if you need more help spending your coin. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> You'll probably want to call and tell 'em what you are planning to make sure the wheel offset and index diameter works with the drum/hub, but I'm sure you're not the first person who desires the redundancy of duallies without needing the carring capacity and footprint of tandem axles.

Randii

I know Waynes trailer doesn't have a ton of tongue weight as it doesn't squat the van much. It's more than I can lift, but not hard to run up with the jack. I'm sure if you PM him on pirate he can get you exact measurements. IIRC the deck is around 12' and the overall length is about 16'

Dallas

Just got your Pm and thought I might as well answer over here:



I have never weighed any of my stuff.. The tongue with the buggy loaded is just right for my van. I weigh 240 lbs, and when I jump on the back of the van it doesn't drop much, the trailer will drop it a bit more then that when I have the buggy in the right balance range. So 300 - 500 lbs????

I can adjust the tongue weight by how far I pull the buggy forward on the trailer. When in the rear location it will not have enough tongue weight and will be a little squirmy on the roads. I towed in this condition once. It was not horrible, but it wasn't much fun either. Would not want to do it on an icy mountain road, thats for sure!

All the way forward on the trailer is OK, but my ideal seems to be to pull the buggy all the way forward, drop in the tail lights, and use the straps to pull it back just a bit. Too much weight on the rear of the minivan makes those soft springs a little low to the ground, and in big dips and potholes will tend to slam the hitch into the ground. Yep, the hitch not the very low trailer.

I seem to recall reading that ideal tongue weight is around 500 lbs for bumper tows.

My word of advise is to put a good tire on there, especially if you are only going to run 2 tires. I borrowed Dallas' trailer once, and killed one of the cheap LT tires, and it wasn't a long drive. With my trailer and trailer tires I have yet to kill a tire. Heck, they still look new.

With a good balance on my triler I hardly know the thing is back there. An added benefit of the small and low trailer is that I can run around gas stations and even an occasional drive through without much issue, it tracks the van very well.

I kept the tongue very short. Just long enough to clear the van's bumper in a SHARP turn. I have to hit nearly a 80 degree angle when putting this thing into my condo garage.

If I tow the trailer empty, like in the picture Dallas posted above, I have to add some tongue weight. (it has zero tongue weight when empty.. it sits level, no need for a tongue jack) If I tow it empty, it just bounces around on the hitch and shakes the receiver on the tow rig something crazy.

I only have brakes on one axle, and that seems perfect. It was all about dollars at the time, but I also think it is safer for these light weight trailers. If I lock the trailer brakes, the un-braked axle helps avoid a jack knife issue. My van stops better when I have the trailer behind it.

If you have the length and width to play with, I'd just make it so the trailer tires are outside the Amigo's track width so you can simply adjust the location of the Amigo to get a good balance. If this is not an issue, and you later discover a balance issue, I'd just add a water of fuel tank to the trailer that you could fill to get a good tongue weight. (Gilbert had to do something along these lines to his little trailer he built.. I think he used 1" plate steel to get more tongue weight, and then some tanks on top of that...)

Long winded, but I hope it helps some.

-Wayne

With a tandem, I don't see any good reason to make the tongue any longer then needed to clear the tow vehicle. With a single axle, I have no idea. I would think steering only gets worse when you have a longer tongue.

Luckily we don't have much side area when towing a vehicle on a flat bed trailer. I have towed in HEAVY cross winds, and my trailer does not try to steer me off the road like an enclosed would. But the wind pushing the van around does cause some pendulum effects with the trailer. Still, far less then any other trailers I have towed.

As a side note, I once towed an 18 foot flat bed with a lifted Samurai. The flat bed had another Samurai, and a bunch of junk on it.. That was fun!! Worst tow idea ever!! Luckily it was a short distance on residential streets. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/scared.gif" alt="" />

-Wayne

Is it just me or is that a total oxymoron,that being a rock buggy being towed by a mini van. There's just something worng with that. Nice trailer though.


Go tandem for the sole reason of safety. I've been the first respond to a few accidents involving single axles. None were pretty and usually it was the innocent bystander who got the brunt of the decision to go single axle.

Ok, ya'll have skeerd and bullied me into making a tandem work. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/shiner.gif" alt="" /> With a little work on the outriggers for the springs, I can get about 7.5% tongue weight (400 lbs.)



If/when I ever get around to extending my wheelbase, then it'll fit even better. If it just doesn't want to work very well, worst case is I can pull forward more so the rear wheels come up out of the pockets. The trailer axle is wide enough.

The main frame is together & I found a place in Phoenix that has the axles in stock for nearly as good a price as ordering online, and I can get them before the weekend.

--Dan

Looks great Dan. When are you planning on leaving for moab? I think my mom and I are gonna be taking the southern route this year and driving through Phoenix, then heading to Monument Valley for the RedBull AirRace which is on the 12th.

Dallas

I like the tandem axle design and all the benefits of them. I just towed a rodeo on my trailer and it was a very smooth ride, even with wind. I have a truck box on the front of my trailer and just throw a lot of weight in there when I need more tongue weight.

Dan, here's my take on this.

Sorry it's real long.

I've been following this and think your going to appreciate the Tandeum axles better when loaded.

I have two car hauler trailers, one with single axle, and a tandeum axle one. Soon to have three trailers. The baby trailer is 12 ft, all aluminum, and single axle. The Momma trailer is 16 ft steel and tandeum axles and tandeum brakes. The big Daddy I'm building, as I get time, is 30 ft and has 2 axles now and maybe three axles with brakes on two of the axles when I get done with it. It needs a floor and new tires to finish.

I can carry a Samuri well enough on the aluminum single axle, but for anything heavier even behind my 3/4 Dodge it will kick me in the back of the head the entire trip. It will never let me forget it's back there. Even when I'm just hauling my motorcycles. It's tounge is long and has a compartment for the tie downs and the spare tire inbetween the frame rails forward of the axle. I made it so the axle will slide about 30 inches to get better balance with the loads. It was originally built to haul my Baja Dune Buggy. But, it has carried Samuri's, the Troopers and even the Rodeo (before the SAS). Not recommended because the Rodeo was too heavy. The torsion axle is adjustable and is rated at 4K lbs.

But with the 16' tandeum, I sometimes have to look in the mirror to make sure it's still back there because it tows so well. The axles are rated at 3,500lbs each.

Both trailers have electric brakes and I have even towed both at the same time. The aluminum one in the rear. (that's how I got Jeff Mason's Sammy here from Georgia.) As far as stopping, electric brakes are the way to go cause you can dial them in as you need them. Had surge brakes on the single axle for a while and it was always a crapshoot, as far as I was concerned, as to wether there would be enough braking when I needed it. Balance was a lot more critical as you know. But the tandeum balance isn't such a big deal. Balance and tounge weight are real important if your tow rig is a little on the light side.

I'm on my second set of tires on the tandeum and let me repeat what Dallas said. Your gonna wish you had tandeum axles if you ever blow out a trailer tire on a single axle trailer with it loaded. Talk about pucker factor! <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/scared.gif" alt="" /> Ask me how I know!!!!
We're on the fourth set of tires on the aluminum one. I cut more tires on it for some reason, and just don't trust them with a load at 70 mph that way.

Just remember that as you design and build this trailer that once you have it available your going to find more uses for it than just carring your Amigo on it. I've hauled more firewood on my aluminum trailer than I want to think about. The short trailer is better for parking in the lot at work when I make araingements with the Company Tree Trimmers for a load of firewood. Cool Perk when I can get it.

You know all this already, but I felt compelled to reinforce the General Concensis.

Later,

Curtis