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more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? #881771 04/19/08 10:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 51
R
RustNeverSleeps Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
When we left last week you will remember that my 86 22r was hard to start, hard to keep running, stumbled, backfired, and was making popping and ticking sounds that got better at higher RPMs.

I'd just installed a head from Engnbldr; stock w/268 cam. I'd replaced the head bolts, vacume, fuel, coolant, and EGR hoses, cleaned the EGR pipe, replaced the EGR valve and Vacume Modulator. Engine had a remanufactered stock carb, Doug Thor head, reman dist w/ new vac. advances, and new fuel pump all installed 3 years ago, ran fine. Valves were adjusted as per Haynes manual (they do sound to be ticking a little).

I checked and re-checked; the crank is at TDC. The cam pin is at 1200 and points to the timing marks on the sprocket. Chain was loose on the drivers side, tight on the pass side. It was tight on both sides after running a couple minutes. Dist rotor pointed to #1. There is spark to all 4 plugs.

Now, back at the ranch. Engnbldr suggested I check the compression. Results:

#1 160 psi, leaked down to 158 after 5 min.
#2 160 "........................" 155 "........"
#3 144 "........................" 143 "........"
#4 144 "........................" 143 "........"

If I recall, the margin for high/low difference is 10%. The 16 lb difference is exactly 10%. I have no idea how long compression is supposed to hold, but this seemed pretty good. Does this mean my valves are 100% ok? Or just not TOO bent up?

Any new suggestions as to what's happening? BTW #'s 1,2 & 3 plugs were soot-blackened (new plugs/wires).

Thanks...Rusty

Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: RustNeverSleeps] #881772 04/20/08 04:53 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 51
R
RustNeverSleeps Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
Anybody out there? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: RustNeverSleeps] #881773 04/20/08 07:36 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,576
engnbldr Offline
Roll Me Over
*****
>>>*Evening!

It looks like maybe just you and me around tonight, everything seems slow out there.

You have eliminated any bent valves, that's good. Plus it sounds like you have eliminated valve timing too, although the actual timing mark isn't in line with the cam dowel pin, it is slightly left.

The next steps are all tuning issues. Also the cam/head combo adds airflow potential so if the system was lean before it could be way lean now.

You may need to get her onto a systems analyzer to trace down the problem. Check for any codes, too.....*EB


*Beats the he** outa me!....*LOL**...
Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: engnbldr] #881774 04/20/08 05:03 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 51
R
RustNeverSleeps Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
To the left, huh? That's bugging me. Could the sprocket be one tooth off without damaging any valves? If so, wouldn't that make the truck run like this? Also, last time I replaced a head, same thing happened. I went out to the garage every weekend and re-installed the dist. and re-adjusted the carbs (old triumphs had twin carbs) and one day, like magic, it worked (but it took a year).

I hate to go to the dealer if I don't have to but this quirky little stuff...thanks...Rusty

Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: RustNeverSleeps] #881775 04/20/08 05:58 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 201
T
toyomorph Offline
Wheeler
HI. Did you follow these procedures when you installed your timing chain? reading through might help. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
timing chain install

here's a picture of the cam gear and the relationship of the chain bright link and the dots on the gear. Does yours look like this? You can see what engnbldr means about the timing dots being slightly to the left of the dowel pin slot.
[Linked Image]


canyon country explorer
1993 4x PUP
Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: RustNeverSleeps] #881776 05/03/08 06:41 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 51
R
RustNeverSleeps Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
As memory recalls, I believe that my t.c. setup looked like that pictured. I goofed around with trying to remove a phantom kink in the crank side (bottom) of the chain until I realized that the t.c. was spring loaded and I had to pry the upper sprocket up to get it to slide onto the cam. I am beginning to think I need to tale the timing chain cover off and make sure everything is lined up.

Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: RustNeverSleeps] #881777 05/11/08 12:11 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 51
R
RustNeverSleeps Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
I got to looking closer at the timing chain and sprockets, cam, & crank. The cam is where it should be, mark on sprocket lines up with arrow on bearing cover. The roter points to #1 wire. But, when I turn the crank with a socket wrench, the timing mark on the crank pulley can move from 5 degrees before to 5 degrees after top dead center without ever moving the cam sprocket. Now that seems to me to be alot of slop in the timing mechanism. Timing chain & sprockets were replaced, presumably, 80k ago when I swapped out the original motor for a Jasper crate motor. Time for new timing chain & sprocket? If so,what else do I replace? Crank sprocket? Cover--didn't I read they are often worn nearly through? Guides (or whatever you call them, the rails that keep the chain tight and from slopping against the cover). Aren't there some kind of aftermarket ones that don't wear out as fast? Is there a kit I can get for the whole shebang? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Re: more on: rough running--new head--cam placement? [Re: RustNeverSleeps] #881778 05/12/08 06:51 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 14
A
anotherjeff Offline
Need a Spot
I'll jump in here...

There's a tensioner that keeps the chain taut. But, at 80k miles, and you're in there anyway, you should definitely replace the timing chain set! (And inspect the cover.) The steel backed guides cost a little more. I like http://stores.ebay.com/Mizumo-Auto-Parts for parts!


'92 Blue 4WD ExtCab 22RE 5spd A/C
'89 Blue 4Rnr 3VZE 5spd A/C
'89 Black 4WD Std Cab 5spd 22RE A/C
'89 White 2WD Std Cab 4spd 22R A/C
'78 Orange 2WD LB 5spd 20R A/C

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