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Re: Former Pakistani ISI chief - Mumbai and 9-11 = Inside Job - CNN [Re: bretwalda] #909561 12/08/08 07:55 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,892
stony-man Offline
Web Wheeler
*****
Well, that proves it.



<img src="/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Re: Former Pakistani ISI chief - Mumbai and 9-11 = Inside Job - CNN [Re: stony-man] #909562 12/09/08 09:56 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,634
bretwalda Offline OP
Roll Me Over
That wasn't the point.

But how does a coincidence theorist explain Mukhtar Ahmed, a ôcounterinsurgency police officer" for the Indian government being arrested for illegally buying mobile phone cards used by the Mumbai gunmen?

You can't get a more botched false flag than this one. Police on total stand down as they watch these guys - from protective cover mind you -tearing up the crowd. 1200 commandoes vs. 12 gunmen...for 60hrs? Why was the anti-terror chief one of the first to go with a bullet to the back of his head? Two Paki ships and a dingy sloshing around city limits while India gets an intelligence warning of the attack? Where the hell did these guys get and stage the ammo for 60hrs of shoot-em-up?

The problem is, the concerned majority in Pakistan got off their duff and did something - They took to the streets and scared Mushareff poopless, even after his groupies popped off Bhuto they kept on truckin. The citizens deposed the USA funded (BILLION$) dictator and democratically appointed their own leader. A big no-no within the world of over-arching globalist agendas. So what do the hawks still have? The ISI . CIA orchestrated and funded, as it was on 9-11-01 when they wired $200K to Atta a few days before, and the ISI chief broke bread in D.C. with Sen. Bob Grahm, Armitage, and Tenet while the planes were plowing through WTC.

So while the Paki leadership is telling us (where you can find it) they condemn this act and have it in for the ISI themselves - the globalists are screaming the more palpable and generalized mantra, 'Pakistan - git em!' Cuz they don't need ISI - ISI is already theirs. They need destabilization.

And this little scam is falling short - especially in India were folks are a little more geo-politically astute. I think Powell's cryptics are still worthy of consideration.


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Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: bretwalda] #909563 12/09/08 08:04 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,634
bretwalda Offline OP
Roll Me Over


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Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: bretwalda] #909564 12/13/08 05:54 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,634
bretwalda Offline OP
Roll Me Over


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Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: bretwalda] #909565 12/13/08 07:14 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,634
bretwalda Offline OP
Roll Me Over


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Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: bretwalda] #909566 12/13/08 12:23 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 10,238
FrankR Offline
Web Wheeler
****
There's nothing new in the way the Fed treats disclosure. The reason they've never disclosed the identity of the parties they lend to is to avoid rumors of financial trouble that could lead to a run on the institution that receives the loan.

What IS new is the amount of money that they're throwing at current problems and the level of risk taken. Some of it would likely be considered reckless by prior standards.

It's a real question if transparency would be a good thing so folks have oversight - or if the oversight would lead to pure panic and trigger a further collapse.

Frank


'89 [color:"white"]G-Raider[color:"white"] [color:"black"]Supercharged 3.0L, MegaSquirt 2, lockup A/T, 2.5" exhaust, 172k, Cibie H4s/Oscar SCs, Hella Micro DE fogs, Cobra CB, Superwinch hubs, LSD rear/Aussie Locker front, Bilsteins, Lifeline AGM, Rust-Oleum
Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: FrankR] #909567 12/16/08 10:54 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,634
bretwalda Offline OP
Roll Me Over
You make the call:

Light pole at the Pentagon on 9-11 :

[Linked Image]


Same pole close up from the back:
[Linked Image]

Look at the base.





A pic of pole bases used in the area:
[Linked Image]


hmm.


concreteprinter.com
Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: bretwalda] #909568 12/17/08 12:12 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 10,238
FrankR Offline
Web Wheeler
****
Yeah - I know somebody who knows somebody who said he saw somebody torching the base of that pole just before the plane flew into the Pentagon.

I think he chopped down the pole so the plane wouldn't get knocked off course.

Obviously it's an inside job. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

Phil, for goodness sakes - the pole base ripped apart at the weakest point.

Frank


'89 [color:"white"]G-Raider[color:"white"] [color:"black"]Supercharged 3.0L, MegaSquirt 2, lockup A/T, 2.5" exhaust, 172k, Cibie H4s/Oscar SCs, Hella Micro DE fogs, Cobra CB, Superwinch hubs, LSD rear/Aussie Locker front, Bilsteins, Lifeline AGM, Rust-Oleum
Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: FrankR] #909569 12/17/08 01:49 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,892
stony-man Offline
Web Wheeler
*****
I hit a pole base like that in front of our school(the pole had been removed), and it broke off exactly like the one in the pic. Made a heck of a racket, and shot about 10 feet across the lot.

Re: The eons old modus operandi [Re: stony-man] #909570 12/17/08 02:52 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 10,238
FrankR Offline
Web Wheeler
****
Most of those poles are designed to snap off at the base so drivers that hit them won't be killed:

Quote
Section 3: Breakaway Light Poles
Anchor: #CHDDCGCC
Frangibility Requirement
The FHWA adopted Section 7 of the 1985 AASHTO publication entitled ôStandard Specifications for Structural Supports for Highway Signs, Luminaires, and Traffic Signalsö for implementation beginning in July 1990. This section requires more stringent breakaway characteristics. TxDOTÆs previous design of roadway illumination assemblies (based on a 1975 AASHTO specification) does not meet these requirements.

Breakaway light poles rely on frangible transformer bases to provide the breakaway feature. The 1985 AASHTO specification provides for a maximum change in momentum of a 1800 pound car to break the pole away. The 1975 AASHTO specification provided for a similar change in momentum except that the test vehicle weighed 2,250 pounds.

Anchor: #i1000249
Structural Requirement
While providing the necessary frangibility, the base must also be structurally adequate to support the illumination pole for design wind speeds. Transformer bases meeting the Æ85 AASHTO specification may not adequately support some 50 foot steel poles, notably those designed to meet the Æ75 AASHTO specification.


Department of Transportation

So, I guess we can decide that the government WAS involved...... <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

Want more proof?:

Transportation Research Board

Transpo Breakaway Signs

More Transpo Lifesaving Designs

And for a full explanation, this SHOULD suffice (but probably won't):

Quote

PENTAGON RESEARCH


LAMP POLES


5 aluminum lamp poles were knocked down preceding the Pentagon wall. Through contact with the VDOT, the distributors and manufacturers of the poles used in the area I have been able to determine the following basic information.*

1) The poles were breakaway style on a 18 inch transformer style base. This means that at 23 inches off the ground the pole would be broken by a Volkswagen Rabbit traveling 20 mph.
2) The poles themselves were 27.66 feet high with a weight of approximately 175 pounds.
3) The truss style mast arms were 8 foot long with a rise that brought the pole height up to 30 feet. The mast arm weighs between 15-20 pounds.
4) The lamp head weighs approximately 70 pounds.
5) The aluminum on the poles was .188 of an inch thick. The pole was 8 inches in diameter at the base and 4.5 inches in diameter at the top.

Since the light poles are the first physical damage we encounter at the Pentagon I will break the rest of this page into a consideration of them in light of a plane and a no-plane point-of-view. This is very important in order to continue on into the rest of our investigation. The damage preceding the Pentagon wall has to be logically accounted for in either scenario.

PLANE

At the speed of 345 mph which was recorded by the recovered AA77 flight data recorder, the leading edge of the wing could slice through the approximately 5 inch diameter pole (at that height) with .188 of an inch thick aluminum walls like butter. This would cause the top half of the pole to pop up over the wing and essentially fall straight back down, which is effectively what we see with all the poles in the photos. The bottom half of the pole would have been driven forward with little resistance. If a VW Rabbit can break one at 20 mph 23 inches off the ground then it takes significantly less force with the leverage effect of being hit higher up. This may be why we have minimal wing debris on the ground.

This limited damage factor is why the FAA requires these type of poles in the "safety zones" around airports and helipads. They recognize that this type of pole minimizes damage to aircraft, "FAA regulation requires any structure located within 250 feet of runway centerline has to be frangible, which means the structure needs to break away when hit by an aircraft to minimize damages to the aircraft and its pilot." (Source)

One of the most commonly reported features in the eyewitness reports was the aircraft impacting light poles. In conjunction with the reported striking of the poles many eyewitnesses mentioned a change in the sound of the engines. Some described it as the engines being "revved up" or the aircraft going to "full-throttle".

The minimum wingspan required to create the pole damage was approximately 100 feet. The maximum wingspan before you would have had additional poles impacted is approximately 140 feet. The wingspan of a 757-200 is 124 feet 10 inches. This accounts for the minimum of 100 feet and allows for a 16 foot tolerance which is exactly what we see in the diagrams.

The first pole impact occurred at approximately 1000 feet prior to the Pentagon wall. 345 mph is 506 per second. That means it would have been roughly 2 seconds with the aircraft being driven by momentum between the first pole and the wall. There would not have been the force or the time for the pole damage to cause a deviation in the flight-path.

The following video exemplifies evidence for an aircraft hitting the Pentagon including the poles. I spoke with the creator of this and clarified that they built their model and let what happened happen. The right engine ingesting the lamp head on pole number 3 was not programmed into their scenario, it was predicted by the model. This would explain the change in the engine sound reported by witnesses and the anomalous vapor trail at ground level seen in the DoD videos.


NO PLANE

If there was no plane or an aircraft with a wingspan of less than 100 feet then the light pole damage would still have to be accounted for. The no plane proponents suggest a faking of this damage. I will just list the implications of this scenario since I have not come across a realistic explanation for how this could have been done.

1) The perpetrators would have to have decided on what type of aircraft and what the wingspan of the "imaginary" plane would be in advance.
2) They would have to have agreed on a flight-path and predetermined the poles to be "damaged".
3) They would have to have had caused the poles to break up high and at the base assuming an imaginary altitude for the aircraft.
4) They would have to have had total control of all witnesses in the area including suppressing the witnesses who noticed the poles falling for no reason.
5) They would have to have had briefed the controlled witnesses on the type of plane, the flight-path, the poles being hit and the change to the engine sound.
6) They would have to have synchronized the falling of the poles with the explosion at the wall.

That gives just some idea of what you are up against in a no plane scenario. Keep in mind when you look at the photos in the sidebars there is no evidence of explosives at the upper break or the base of the poles. Also, remember they would have gone to all of this trouble to account for about 12 feet of altitude. Why not just say the plane came in at a slightly steeper angle?

* The information on the poles is representative of the poles in the area. They had different manufacturers and distributors over the years. I could not acquire information specific to the exact poles impacted. One of the main manufacturers is Union Metal.


There's even a video here:

Pentagon Research

I'm tellin' you - a conspiracy theorist's work is never done. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />

Frank


'89 [color:"white"]G-Raider[color:"white"] [color:"black"]Supercharged 3.0L, MegaSquirt 2, lockup A/T, 2.5" exhaust, 172k, Cibie H4s/Oscar SCs, Hella Micro DE fogs, Cobra CB, Superwinch hubs, LSD rear/Aussie Locker front, Bilsteins, Lifeline AGM, Rust-Oleum
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