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Winch fed off of starter primary wire? #912729 10/26/08 11:22 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 970
R
RatLabGuy Offline OP
Rock Warrior
I'm re-running the massive wires for my winch so I can get the solenoids off of the unit and safely under the hood, and hook up in-cab cotrol to boot.
I have a nice open empty spot on the passenger side, up near the firewall in front of the charcoal cannister, seems lie ka nice place for the solenoids. Other potential locale would be the opposite side beside the brake MC.
i've swapped my battery and AFM, so putting it on the pass. side means running cabe across the radiator/engine bay... grr...
But I was thinking - what about instead feeding the solenoid box off of the primary wire going to the starter? E.g. add a loop on the starter hot contact. That already has a nice 2 ga deadicated line going to it, then maybe ground to the engine block (since the battery ground goes right there anyway).
Everything else on the truck runs off of the alternator/fuse block primary, leaving only the starter to "share" the line... but I can't think of any reason to ever run the starter and winch simultaneously, either...?
Thoughts?


With 200+ Billion electrical parts, the world most complicated machine is inside your own skull.

Question Reality.
-----------------------------
'89 Rnr DLX "SR4.5", 32s w/ 5.29 locked f/r blah blah
Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: RatLabGuy] #912730 10/27/08 01:11 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 395
Runner-Man Offline
Mudrunner
Just some thoughts:

Every connection increases resistance, and this would add one more. It would also add another point for corrosion, or a loose bolt to cause trouble.

Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: Runner-Man] #912731 10/27/08 01:21 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 970
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RatLabGuy Offline OP
Rock Warrior
Quote
Just some thoughts:

Every connection increases resistance, and this would add one more. It would also add another point for corrosion, or a loose bolt to cause trouble.


I was thinking teh same thing... but for the alternative... you have a wire going to the battery, and having to be double-tapped on the leads. That's also an extra connection; and that one really bugs me b/c I can't get my rubber connector boot covers properly in place due to the extra connection.


With 200+ Billion electrical parts, the world most complicated machine is inside your own skull.

Question Reality.
-----------------------------
'89 Rnr DLX "SR4.5", 32s w/ 5.29 locked f/r blah blah
Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: RatLabGuy] #912732 10/27/08 04:51 AM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 4,230
OOP'S Offline
Roll Me Over
Every instruction manual I have ever read on hooking up a winch says go directly to the battery.


David Fritzsche
1990 Ex-Cab V-6,5-speed, with a few mods
04.5 CTD Dodge 2500 Ram--Tow Rig
Roseville, CA

"Serenity through Sobriety"
Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: OOP'S] #912733 10/27/08 05:18 AM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 882
M
missouriman Offline
Rock Warrior
I have two of what you are asking about, I can take pictures on Monday.
you have to buy about 80 bucks worth of cable.
I think I bought 20 feet of black and 12 feet of red.
I think that you would only need 12 of black and 8 of red.
I had not done it before and didn't want to end up with a 5 foot piece that was 6 inches short, if you know what I mean.

for the ends I had to go to a welding supply place.

I used, first a cable TV end crimper then used a dull chisel to really bend them in, then I soldered them.

figuring out the warn 5 wire control took a little work with the ohm meter as I didn't want it to short out.

in cab I have an on off switch that also shuts down the out side controller. so no one can come up and short the correct poles and get the winch to work.
the second is a double pull double throw temporary switch that actually winds the winch in and out.

we both love the in cab controls.
and if you are alone you can also just plug the hand controll into the front of the truck.

also I used the side cable connection to run the truck wireing and the top poles for the winch connection.

Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: RatLabGuy] #912734 10/27/08 05:20 AM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 882
M
missouriman Offline
Rock Warrior
oh... just re read.. your battery is on the wrong side.... that would take at least and extra 20 feet or more of wire.
can you swap it back?
we have a really clean set up.

I would not run it off the starter. I think that you would end up with a dual hot and it could cause alot of heat in the starter wire. not to metion a possible back feed to the smaller wires.

(yeh that sounds stupid but thinking of the ground loop part of it.)

Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: RatLabGuy] #912735 10/27/08 09:15 AM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 4,282
ldivinag Offline
Roll Me Over
the only problem i see with your setup is the the 2 gauge wire coming from the starter to the batt.

remember, your alternator is like what... 60-80 amps at most?

the battery will be supplying most of the juice when you start doing some regular to hard core winching.

now, like my warn 9000XDi, which says like 350 amps at max pull, guess what that does to the a 2 gauge wire.


i suggest redoing all links in the winch chain to 0 to 00 gauge cable...


leo d.

90 4runner, v6, auto, WCOR CitB kit,
marlin duals, arb rear, tt front
4.88, blah, blah, blah...

Pres. of TEAM IFS! and
GETTING OFF 4WD Club member
Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: missouriman] #912736 10/28/08 02:40 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 970
R
RatLabGuy Offline OP
Rock Warrior
Quote
oh... just re read.. your battery is on the wrong side.... that would take at least and extra 20 feet or more of wire.
can you swap it back?
we have a really clean set up.

I would not run it off the starter. I think that you would end up with a dual hot and it could cause alot of heat in the starter wire. not to metion a possible back feed to the smaller wires.

(yeh that sounds stupid but thinking of the ground loop part of it.)


Good God man, 20 feet?
When I moved the battery (it now sits right behind the coolant bottle on the D-side corner), it only took a 6' hot wire to go from there to the starter on the other side (went down under radiator and over). 3 negatives (body, frame, engine) totalling maybe about 4' between them.
The proposed locale for the solenoids is only at most 2' length from the starter, so that's just that more new hot wire, plus maybe same of ground to the block. Still have to ru nfrom solenoid to winch, but I have the 6' or whatever cables that came with it, they'll be plenty. So total purchase is like 4' total,

I don't see what you mean by "double-hot". No reason the starter and winch would ever run simultaneously. The small-guage "on" hot line for the starter is isolated from the main via the starter solenoid.

I will definitely confirm the starter wire ga I used.
I do find it interesting the wires supplied w/ the winch (REP 8000) are only 2 ga at most, maybe even less, since according to their own website the max current is more than spec for this size.


With 200+ Billion electrical parts, the world most complicated machine is inside your own skull.

Question Reality.
-----------------------------
'89 Rnr DLX "SR4.5", 32s w/ 5.29 locked f/r blah blah
Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: RatLabGuy] #912737 10/28/08 03:49 AM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 882
M
missouriman Offline
Rock Warrior
well there are 3 main wires and a ground if you want it.
remember that Toyota's are ground based switches and not positive connections.
you can argue with me if you want, or I can post up pictures of our set ups.
you asked advice. my advice is free but not open to any argument. it is only my advice. and what is working for me.

Re: Winch fed off of starter primary wire? [Re: missouriman] #912738 10/28/08 03:55 AM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 882
M
missouriman Offline
Rock Warrior
do you want pictures or not..
what you want to do will work.. if, you don't burn off all the NEGATIVE OR GROUND connections.. the positives only have to be 2 ga.. so what if they warm up.. so what if your alt only puts out 60 amps.. any time you winch it is going to come off the battery.

an electrical connection is made up of two things.
power.
and return.. the ground wire.
you are looking at only the power side.. the same amps have to return... duh... the ground side.. are you getting it yet???

you can hook up a biazzion gage wire to your winch, but with out a ground it will not work....
that is the dual hot that I am am talking about. dual hot ground that is.. toyota's are back wards. like the positive is ground and ground is hot. but they are still a negative ground.. but the switches and every ground is back wards.
they are a negative ground with a negative switch.
where as everything we are used to is a negative ground, negative ground and turn on and off the positive. toyota's turn on and off the ground.



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