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Help with 87 4Runner 22RE aka "Ocho Zero". Low compression #1, and more #916785 11/20/08 10:15 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 54
S
spungo Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
Thanks to a fellow who couldn't spell very well ("fore runner"), I got a pretty nice, rust-free 220K miles 4Runner for $80 and change on ebay. We call her "Ocho Zero".

The redneck who owned it put a short block in and couldn't get it to run right again. Started running hot, so they did a head gasket (not sure if he had a good reason to do that), and never worked right again. Wifey didn't like the old truck making the bank's McMansion look run down, so she made him unload the Toy and borrow 30K to buy a Durango, which started falling apart at 20K miles. Bummer for him.

I found a big crack in the downpipe from exhaust manifold and replaced it, but it still ran like crap. Unexpectedly got another Toy to restore, so this one got shoved in the garage for 3 years.

Thanks to a stupid lady who doesn't know how to drive, our daily driver was brutally killed 4 months ago. It's great to be rid of the Chevy Blazer, which was doing the standard GM self-destruct, but my girlfriend was hurt real bad. Thankfully, it looks like she'll be driving again in another month, so it's time to resurrect a 4Runner.

I dropped the fuel tank and cleaned it out, new Denso fuel pump, injectors serviced by Witchunter Performance, fuel filter changed and, of course, relocated to fender well. Intake cleaned, TPS painstakingly set, all the other little things checked. Found some misrouting on the vac hoses, cracks in others. Autolite plugs replaced by NGK, of course, NGK plug wires, too. Infamous injector splices in harness beefed up. Valves carefully set (cold) to factory spec.

She fired right up and purred at idle, but the timing chain rattle at start up was insane, lasting about 3 seconds. Set timing to spec using jumper, held steady, idling nice. I was quite pleased.

But, giving her throttle, she rattles bad, increasing with more throttle. Stethoscope tells me it's timing chain slap....I think.

Turned her off to round up diagnostic gear, and she wouldn't start again! Aftermarket key cylinder froze up. Couldn't even get it to ACC position for easy removal. D'OH! Waited for used OEM ignition switch, cheap from ebay.

Fired her up again a week later, same brief chain slap on start up. Like a can full of rocks gettin' shook. Chain guides are OK, USA stamp on cam gear indicates replacement when engine cracked open by PO.

Turn engine with wrench to zero timing mark, it took about 15 degrees backing up before the rotor moved. That sure don't seem right.

It's not the top oil pump bolt thing - I looked down there, pretty sure I don't see it protruding. I suspect the PO used an impact wrench to put the timing chain tensioner on, or at least overtorqued it. Perhaps it's a bum aftermarket part, but at this point I strongly suspect a problem with the tensioner.

Compression test - 170 on 2, 3, and 4. 100-105 on #1. Wet test, #1 jumped to 140-150. Leakdown, air hissing out of oil cap at BDC and a good ways before and after from a mere 25 PSI.

I'm skeptical of a suggestion that the ring's ain't seated. Compression way too low, and letting out light air pressure way too easy. The second gauge on my leakdown tester went knobs-up on me, so I lack precise data, but I've shot enough air into enough engines to know this ain't right.

The replacement short block has very few miles on it and came from a crank-em-out fast urban engine mill. They have a slightly better reputation than many, but I wouldn't have used 'em. I think the installation of the rings was botched. I've seen that happen before.

So, the engine's gotta come out, which is no big deal for me.

Since it's coming out, and the head is the original one, she's getting an EB head and stick, and upgraded exhaust to match my other 2 22RE rides. I'll get the deck height/quench dialed in real nice-like and stick it all together with some ARP stuff.

I'm inclined to replace the timing kit with EB's stuff, OEM tensioner torqued to 12 ft/lb. When I crack it all open, I'll post some photos and measurements of what I find in #1. Hopefully, new rings for #1, an extra set of bearings, and some Plastigauge will do the trick, but I'm far from an expert on evaluating what's up inside the cylinders.

The PO and his buds were terrible wrenchers. Many fasteners missing, oil filter way too tight, lots of little stuff like tranny cooler lines not secured, parts not cleaned, etc. They did the bare minimum to have a crack at driving the thing around the block. Me, I'm a fanatic about that stuff and have gone to great lengths to remedy it all. Good thing I like doing this.

So, opinions on what I've found so far are greatly appreciated. I'll update this thread until she's running good as new.

This will be the daily driver for a super-cool chick who hates shopping and talking on the phone, but loves football, camping, fishing, and 4-wheelin'. She'll happily hop out of bed in a garter belt and thong to hand crank an engine while I pull torque converter bolts. She thinks it's great when I buy tools and engine lifts, and is pretty much a cool guy in a hot chick's body. Never said no to me in 8 years, and has been crippled and beset by suffering for 4 months (again, 100% due to an idiot stranger). Unlike the vast majority of women I've known, she's literally irreplaceable. Once, and only once, she's gotten mad at me - I didn't wake her up for Monday Night Football when she was near-death from the flu.

So, I wanna build her a sweet ride. She deserves it, and, no matter what I have to do, it looks like the cost will be pleasingly low compared to the burden of buying a modern day dungbox, which I'll NEVER again even consider.


1986 Sunrader Motorhome 22RE $200
1987 4Runner 22RE (under construction) $80.77
1989 4Runner 22RE, 6" lift, 35" Dunlop mudders $420
All rescued from sitting to death, all auto, 'cuz I'm too dumb to drive a standard.
Re: Help with 87 4Runner 22RE aka "Ocho Zero". Low compression #1, and more [Re: spungo] #916786 11/21/08 03:04 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 15,887
kewlynx Offline
Toyota & Classifieds Moderator
*****
That's awesome. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />

If those guys were crap wrenchers, I'd be willing to bet they've got one of those TC cover bolts in the wrong place. You've got like 3 different lengths of them. This is why we suggest punching bolts into your favorite beverage box to maintain the pattern. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" /> Yeah, tensioner could still be an issue.

I'd like to see a couple pix of your fuel filter relocation. Sounds like a good standard mod. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />

FSM's sticky'd here at the top if you need 'em. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/notooth.gif" alt="" />


http://www.walkablecommunities.org/

Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.

**ubi apis- ibi salus**
Re: Help with 87 4Runner 22RE aka "Ocho Zero". Low compression #1, and more [Re: kewlynx] #916787 11/21/08 06:09 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 54
S
spungo Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
Kewl, I've read a zillion of your posts. You've been more help than you'll ever know.

Crap wrenchers? Check this out...went out a little while ago to show the old lady how she's gonna help guide a socket attached to a wretched circus of extensions onto the 2 top bellhousing bolt heads when we pull the engine.

One of the bolts ain't there! And, it's the one on the exhaust manifold side that's missing. You'd think the guy would at least have failed to complete the one on the more difficult intake side. Sheesh.

After all the missing things we've found and obtained replacements for, we just had to stand there shaking our heads upon discovery of the missing bell to engine block bolt. I mean, REALLY.

When I unplugged the connectors mid lower steering column to deal with the ignition switch, a bunch of .22 mag spents spilled out. Actually, that was pretty cool. This truck has good spirit. I can feels it, I tells ya.

My garage (and, actually house) looks like a 1st gen Toy parts warehouse, so I use a spare timing cover to hold the bolts during a job. Turned out to be more accurate than the piece of crap drawing I did, which looked more like a rabbit than a mechanical part. Add some whiskers and woo hoo, you gots a bunny, friend.

Which of the bolts on the front of the engine will make trouble if swapped wrong, other than the top oil pump bolt? So far, it seems he got the bolts in the right places. He just didn't install a bunch of 'em

The fuel filter relo. Mercy...whoever designed the original setup was some kind of psycho. I pity the gal who has to bed down with that fellow. On a rig that has seen some dirt, it can be hard to get it all buttoned up without getting things dirty. Those damn copper washers getting dropped and lost, lots of bad language an' woe, hard to get a torque wrench on it, leak more difficult to spot. Not my kind of deal.

On the motorhome, I took the stock hose to the hose shop, they quickly cut off the ends and crimped up a new one, a few inches longer, for 15 bones. Piece of cake.

Next time around on the 4Runner, it struck me to just reroute the hose from the fuel filter out to fuel rail. A friend ran his out thru the middle of the intake, but I didn't like the bend of the hose (snicker), so mine leaves the fuel rail forward under the throttle body, then bends around to the fender well.

All 3 relos I've been part of put the filter near the fusebox. OEM bracket is discarded, two hairy coarse thread hex head screws thru carefully drilled pilot holes attach filter to body. Between filter holes and body I install a short (~1/2") piece of PVC as a standoff, lets me button down the screws nice and tight and the filter sits solidly.

The finger thingees that hold the banjo fittings in place are not an issue. Disregard them and position everything to get a smooth lay for your hose (slaps knee).

It's great to not have to struggle with the fuel line as part of a much larger job. Zap...she's off. Zap...she's on, and it took less effort to set up than it would have taken to put it back in the factory location! I'll post photos.

I keep picturing the PO installing the timing chain tensioner with the Earthquake zip gun Santa done brung him from Harbor Freight.


1986 Sunrader Motorhome 22RE $200
1987 4Runner 22RE (under construction) $80.77
1989 4Runner 22RE, 6" lift, 35" Dunlop mudders $420
All rescued from sitting to death, all auto, 'cuz I'm too dumb to drive a standard.
Re: Help with 87 4Runner 22RE aka "Ocho Zero". Low compression #1, and more [Re: spungo] #916788 11/21/08 06:43 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 15,887
kewlynx Offline
Toyota & Classifieds Moderator
*****
We do what we can. Internet's been good to us eh? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />

Your findings with that thing remind me of an engine I got off a kid a couple years ago. I stripped it for a long block core; water pump had been replaced; had more RTV than snot on a colicky baby; made me wonder what other clogs the coolant jacket might have.

Pulled the oil pan and had a handful of TC links laying in there. Those are pix I should scan and post sometime; before I bought a digi camera.

I think once you take the TC cover off, the wear will tell the story, really. As you've mentioned, overtorquing the tensioner is a real possibility, as I doubt said wrenchers even know what one is. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/shiner.gif" alt="" />

For the OchoRunner, I think ya should hook up with 4Crawler (Roger Brown) and see if he has any 1" body lift pucks for that thing. Will make maintenance in the future easier.

Check the alternator and starter brushes/contacts while you have the engine hopped out of there. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


http://www.walkablecommunities.org/

Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.

**ubi apis- ibi salus**
Re: Help with 87 4Runner 22RE aka "Ocho Zero". Low compression #1, and more [Re: kewlynx] #916789 11/21/08 07:52 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 54
S
spungo Offline OP
Getting the Wheeling Fever
Speaking of too much RTV, one day at a rest stop in Oregon I talked to a nice old couple in a Chinook that had to do a panic 22RE water pump replacement at a Toy dealer during a road trip. Old dude was concerned about amount of RTV, so I took a look.

It was insane. I could have molded a deluxe collection of marital aids from the excess sillycone gushing from the seam. Was sure Rod Serling was about to step out from behind the power steering pump.

I never, ever use RTV on gaskets unless it's solemnly called for. A thin wetting with grease, and on they go. Never had a leak, and snap to disassemble and clean in the future.

Innyhoo, old guy said at least he got a proper OEM pump for his FIVE HUNDRED SIXTY bucks. Nope, it was aftermarket crap!

And, the belt was way too tight. I remedied.

And, the bolts were too tight. I retorqued.

And, it took 26 hours longer than the service guy swore it would, and the old people were in a hurry while having alternate choices nearby ready to do the repair. Dealer said anything to get the job, then did revolting work. Poor people. I hate it when friendly souls get shafted like Lindsey Lohan at Tailhook.

I suggested to the old man that he consider why parts corporations like AutoZone have those discreet unmarked white trucks outside. Shoot, I always thought them big ol' bidnisses like to spread their logo feces around at the highest rate possible. But when delivering parts to a dealer service dept, they suddenly get a case of quiet, shadowy, shy guy. Go figger.

Strangest thing I ever found in an oil pan was a 10" dial caliper. I assume whoever did that was looking everywhere for that doggone thing.

Alternator is a never-installed NAPA retread I got on ebay for 99 cents, and yes, I actually have spare starter contacts on hand at all times. I shudder to think of all the nice OEM starters exchanged for Chinese junk over a repair a monkey going through opiate withdrawal could easily perform.

She gets a complete, right down to the little ones, set of OEM coolant hoses, too. Trying to come as close to a new ride as possible.

The savings, especially across many years, of learning to fix and drive abandoned (but still good) old Toys is STAGGERING compared to the normal "American Way" of buying a Big Three croaker, owned by some sleazy bank, every few years. Over 10 or 12 years, we're talking enough scratch to buy a nice piece of land in the mountains, and, we actually own our vehicles. That rocks.


1986 Sunrader Motorhome 22RE $200
1987 4Runner 22RE (under construction) $80.77
1989 4Runner 22RE, 6" lift, 35" Dunlop mudders $420
All rescued from sitting to death, all auto, 'cuz I'm too dumb to drive a standard.
Re: Help with 87 4Runner 22RE aka "Ocho Zero". Low compression #1, and more [Re: spungo] #916790 11/21/08 08:24 AM
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 15,887
kewlynx Offline
Toyota & Classifieds Moderator
*****
Yeah it rocks. So you've got a Sunrader? Reminds me- I need to find these old folks' phone number. They're giving up the road trips and selling their Granville. I want it. They're the second owners.

Find some 4mm hose for those little hoses. The dang 5/32" stuff just leaks too much.


http://www.walkablecommunities.org/

Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.

**ubi apis- ibi salus**

Moderated by  4Crawler, 4x4Wire, kewlynx 







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